6368 49UJSAT1 1 UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT 1 SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK 2 -------------------------------------x 2 UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, 3 3 v. S1 02 Cr. 395 (JGK) 4 4 AHMED ABDEL SATTAR, a/k/a "Abu Omar," 5 a/k/a "Dr. Ahmed," LYNNE STEWART, 5 and MOHAMMED YOUSRY, 6 6 Defendants. 7 -------------------------------------x 7 8 September 30, 2004 8 9:35 a.m. 9 9 10 10 Before: 11 HON. JOHN G. KOELTL 11 12 District Judge 12 and a jury 13 13 APPEARANCES 14 14 DAVID N. KELLEY, 15 United States Attorney for the 15 Southern District of New York 16 ROBIN BAKER, 16 CHRISTOPHER MORVILLO, 17 ANTHONY BARKOW, 17 ANDREW DEMBER, 18 Assistant United States Attorneys 18 19 KENNETH A. PAUL, 19 BARRY M. FALLICK, 20 Attorneys for Defendant Sattar 20 21 MICHAEL TIGAR, 21 JILL R. SHELLOW-LAVINE, 22 Attorneys for Defendant Stewart 22 23 DAVID STERN, 23 DAVID A. RUHNKE, 24 Attorneys for Defendant Yousry 25 SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6369 49UJSAT1 1 (Trial resumes) 2 (In open court; jury not present) 3 THE COURT: Yes. 4 MR. TIGAR: Your Honor, I spoke with the government 5 counsel last evening, and they are amenable if we are to have 6 argument tomorrow any time, and I am requesting 10:00 o'clock 7 in the morning. In this courtroom or Pearl Street? 8 THE COURT: Pearl Street. All right, 10:00 o'clock 9 tomorrow morning, Courtroom 12 B, Pearl Street. 10 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, I hope that I will be prepared 11 at that time to address the motion. 12 However, although it was served on my office early 13 this morning, at about 8:00 o'clock this morning by Ms. 14 Shellow-Lavine, a copy did not reach me at that time. 15 I went looking for it, and somehow between whoever she 16 gave it to and where I thought I was supposed to pick it up, it 17 went astray, so I just received the papers on my arrival in the 18 courtroom at about 9:15. I am on Page 9 of a 50-page 19 memorandum of law, so I am not yet in a position to 20 definitively know that I will be fully prepared by 10:00 am. 21 If there is leeway in the matter -- if the court is telling me 22 I have no choice, of course, I will. 23 THE COURT: No. A, there is no way for me, and I am 24 prepared to do it late in the day, and for a second, I haven't 25 read the memo. It was waiting for me this morning when I came SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6370 49UJSAT1 1 over here, and the government was going to consider a written 2 response, and you can get back to me on that. 3 My preference is -- well, you can tell me whether the 4 government wants to submit a written response. 5 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, as I requested at the end of 6 the day yesterday, I will let the court know by no later than 7 the end of the lunch hour today whether the government wishes 8 to respond in writing and also whether I will be prepared by 9 10:00 o'clock tomorrow morning. 10 THE COURT: Okay. I leave open the possibility that 11 I'll ask for a written response. Consider that. 12 MR. TIGAR: Your Honor, as a scheduling matter, the 13 court has said late in the day, the government has said late in 14 the day. I have a long-standing family obligation that begins 15 in Westchester County at 6:00 o'clock, and it is of a -- I 16 mean, it is a ceremonial occasion. 17 THE COURT: Okay. We won't do it later than the time 18 for you to get out for that. I can also do it Saturday. 19 MR. TIGAR: There are scheduling difficulties with 20 Saturdays; that is, I have a case my seminar students are 21 doing, a brief due in the D.C. Circuit in a terrorism case, I 22 am due to give a lecture at the law school on some of the 23 issues involved, and I have to meet with those students even 24 though I don't usually work Saturdays, so that is the only day 25 I can do it. Those plans have also been in place for about SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6371 49UJSAT1 1 four months. If the court is going to request I do something 2 about that and cancel it, I would need to know pretty quickly. 3 I mean, I understand my obligations to this court, but 4 I bring these to the court's attention and ask for the court's 5 indulgence. 6 THE COURT: Okay. 7 MR. FALLICK: Your Honor, if we are going to go ahead 8 tomorrow, I would thus like to make sure that Mr. Sattar will 9 be produced tomorrow. 10 THE COURT: Yes. The government should assure that 11 that happens. You may begin. 12 MR. STERN: We have another issue I would like to 13 address with you. 14 THE COURT: Sure. 15 MR. STERN: I have informed the government, when Agent 16 Monaco takes the witness stand, I intend to cross-examine her 17 about items seized in a search of Mr. Yousry's home which are 18 clearly outside of the scope of the warrant. 19 I intend to do that as an attack on both her 20 credibility and the credibility of the search in general since 21 she personally seized every single one of those items. I don't 22 intend to ask about the law of the search, but it seems to me 23 we are entitled to raise the inference in the jury's mind 24 things were not taken where they say they were, the search was 25 done improperly and by taking things outside the warrant. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6372 49UJSAT1 1 I think there are things in dispute outside of the 2 warrant. The warrant authorizes the seizure of many, many 3 things related to IG, related to the Sheikh, related to Ms. 4 Stewart, related to Mr. Sattar, and I am not disputing any of 5 those things, but things, and I will give you examples, but 6 there are many, many examples, like landscape pictures, 7 condolence telegrams on the death of Mr. Yousry's father, books 8 on culture diversity, letters from the International Fellowship 9 of Christians and Jews, a book on agrarian studies in Honduras, 10 those kinds of things were taken. 11 These agents are not going to be asked anything about 12 their understanding of the legality or illegality of the 13 warrant itself. The warrant is presumed to be legal. We are 14 not contesting the legality of the warrant. 15 What we are contesting is their thoroughness and their 16 carefulness in entering a citizen's home and seizing things 17 they're not allowed to under the warrant. That is an attack on 18 their credibility and something I should be allowed to do. 19 I raise it now because I have discussed it with Mr. 20 Morvillo, who has taken a different position. I also inform 21 the court that there are other issues, 403 issues and other 22 issues the court has worked out is the sole issue, the sole 23 issue that remains. 24 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, the government objects and 25 would move to preclude cross-examination of Agent Monaco, the SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6373 49UJSAT1 1 testifying FBI agent, who is the team leader of the search, 2 about whether the seizure of certain documents exceeded the 3 scope of her lawful authority under the search warrant. 4 The proper remedy for a violation of the search 5 warrant would be to either move to suppress the items or to 6 file a motion for the return of the property. Neither step was 7 taken here by Mr. Yousry. 8 Rather he would like to create the impression in the 9 jury's mind that this agent engaged in unlawful conduct, and 10 that is a matter of law for the court to resolve, not a matter 11 of fact that the jury should be considering. It does not go to 12 the agent's credibility. 13 I have no problem with the witness being examined 14 abort whether certain items were taken. That is fine. But the 15 suggestion that those items were taken outside the scope of the 16 warrant, when that warrant was never challenged properly, is 17 something that I think is irrelevant to the issues in the case, 18 and even if it has some marginal relevance, which I don't think 19 it does, it is certainly likely to confuse the jury on a matter 20 of law, not a matter of fact, and it should be precluded by 21 Rule 403. 22 I will note that none of the items from the search 23 that the government is seeking to introduce is there a 24 contention that they were outside the scope of the warrant. 25 This is merely an attempt by the defense to demonstrate that SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6374 49UJSAT1 1 there was a broad execution of the search warrant, perhaps it 2 was overbroad, in their theory, and to allow the jury to have 3 the impression that it was somehow unlawful or illegal is, I 4 submit, improper. 5 MR. STERN: Judge, let me say several things in 6 response: 7 One, it will be ludicrous for us to move to suppress, 8 for example, a book on agrarians in Honduras. The government 9 will say it is moot because we don't intend to move it. 10 Likewise, the resolve to get it back is ludicrous. A 11 government agent disobeyed a direct order from a judge. If the 12 agent's position is these things were lawfully seized, she is 13 welcome to explain it. She can say a picture of an old woman 14 at a birthday party is Bin Laden's mother in an IG response if 15 that is the answer. 16 She has violated a direct order from a judge, telling 17 her what she can do, and she is here to protect the rights of 18 American citizens and protect the needs of law enforcement. 19 The items I read to you, and it is a much longer list I read to 20 you, cannot possibly be justified as being taken within the 21 warrant. It doesn't make sense to say we should suppress 22 things we know the government can't use. It does make sense to 23 say agents who willfully or negligently violate the order of a 24 judge goes to their credibility. They can be impeached with 25 that information. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6375 49UJSAT1 1 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, it is not up to the agent 2 to decide whether something is lawfully or unlawfully seized. 3 That is a matter of law for the court to resolve, and that 4 issue has never been placed before this court, and I don't 5 think on cross-examination of the witness in front of the jury 6 is the place to do that. 7 As far as suppression goes, if it is the defense's 8 position that the search was so unreasonably overbroad, they 9 could have moved to suppress even things that would have been 10 authorized to be seized. So I think that point is actually 11 valid, not ludicrous. 12 THE COURT: Mr. Morvillo, you say that the witness 13 could be cross-examined with respect to the items that were 14 seized? 15 MR. MORVILLO: Yes, your Honor. 16 I believe that, for example, to place in context an 17 exhibit that the government is going to seek to offer, the 18 defense would be entitled to ask the witness what other items 19 were found and seized at that spot. That is permissible. 20 THE COURT: So all of the examination with respect to 21 taking a book on agrarianism or other items that were listed, 22 all of that is a proper subject of cross-examination? 23 MR. MORVILLO: In my opinion, it is, your Honor, but 24 to go a step further and suggest that it was unlawful to seize 25 that document I think is inappropriate and impermissible SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6376 49UJSAT1 1 cross-examination. 2 THE COURT: Well, that is easily solved because there 3 would be an instruction, and I could give an instruction now, 4 which I would give in the final instructions, in any event, 5 with respect to the items that were seized were seized pursuant 6 to a lawful search. The items seized and introduced into 7 evidence were seized subject to a lawful search, and you can 8 consider those items along with all the other evidence in the 9 case. 10 I don't have, I don't have the regular search 11 instructions before me, but that is the gist. 12 MR. STERN: I want to be sure I am clear what I intend 13 to ask is not an issue. I intend to say to the agent, using as 14 the example a book on agrarianism in Honduras, Agent, can you 15 tell me which part of the search warrant authorizes you to 16 seize that book? 17 The search warrant, which I am sure you have seen, 18 limits it to things about the list I have given you, Lynne 19 Stewart, Sattar, Yousry, all of these people. The agent can 20 explain, if there is an explanation. But if not, I believe 21 that that is impeachable. I don't want to leave the -- that I 22 don't intend to ask about the warrant unless the court says I 23 may not. I do intend to ask those kinds of questions. 24 THE COURT: First, there is no objection to the 25 instruction at the appropriate time, am I correct? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6377 49UJSAT1 1 MR. STERN: Yes, absolutely right, there is no 2 objection, no objection. 3 THE COURT: The items that were seized and introduced 4 into evidence were seized pursuant to a lawful search, and you 5 can consider those items along with all the other evidence in 6 the case. 7 MR. STERN: Correct. I don't intend to introduce 8 these items into evidence. I intend to ask about them but not 9 introduce them into evidence. 10 THE COURT: I would allow that examination. 11 MR. MORVILLO: We certainly object to that. 12 That is creating the impression there was something 13 illegal about the search here, and there has been no legal 14 determination that anything that was seized during the course 15 of the search was unlawfully obtained. To throw documents in 16 front of a witness and ask her on the witness stand to justify 17 a decision she made two and a half years ago is completely 18 inappropriate. 19 This is a witness who was a team leader of a large 20 search, during which 22 boxes of documents were seized, most of 21 them, many of them were in the Arabic language, and to require 22 her to sit here and have to flip through a search warrant that 23 she probably hasn't read in two years and justify each item 24 that she may have had far more time to review or another agent 25 may have reviewed at the time and defend her on-the-spot SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6378 49UJSAT1 1 decision that something was responsive, and to the extent that 2 she can defend it, to suggest to the jury that is unlawful, is 3 completely beyond the scope of a proper cross-examination. 4 I think it is prejudicial, confusing, and it should be 5 precluded. Again, I have no problem with questions about what 6 was taken, but to make the link that this was outside the scope 7 of a lawfully-issued warrant that has never been challenged, I 8 think, is inappropriate and should be precluded. 9 I would just add, your Honor, that an instruction 10 which says that items which were introduced into evidence were 11 lawfully seized, the negative of that would be perhaps that 12 things that were not introduced but were shown to the witness 13 were unlawfully seized, and so I don't think the court's 14 instruction addresses this issue. 15 MR. STERN: The government would like that resolved. 16 I am glad to do a hearing out of the presence of the jury 17 whether or not many, many items were seized lawfully or 18 unlawfully. For the court to commence -- it no makes 19 difference to me whether the book on agrarianism in Honduras is 20 suppressed. 21 I am confident any judge, reviewing that warrant and 22 these items, would find they were unlawfully seized. If the 23 government says that is a prerequisite of this 24 cross-examination, I am prepared to do that kind of hearing. 25 Let's bring the agent and review the warrant and it SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6379 49UJSAT1 1 can be made. The government knows these items were unlawfully 2 seized as outside the warrant. Their position is only once a 3 judge says that may I cross-examine. I am prepared to have a 4 hearing and have a judge say that. I think they and I know 5 that will be the ultimate outcome on many, many of these items. 6 MR. MORVILLO: I certainly do not concede that, your 7 Honor. 8 THE COURT: The procedure that the agent followed in 9 executing the warrant would be the subject of the direct 10 examination in any event. The kinds of procedures that she 11 followed to determine whether something was within the warrant 12 and how the items were seized would be something that would be 13 the subject of direct examination. 14 On cross-examination, he then says look, you seized 15 items that went beyond the warrant and you have no procedures. 16 If that is the line of the argument, it is fair 17 cross-examination. If the response is: "I don't recall those 18 individual items, I don't recall the procedures that we 19 followed with respect to determining whether something was, and 20 I certainly don't recall with respect to that," so be it. 21 The instruction is a valid instruction, and if the 22 cross-examination goes too far in the sense that it becomes 23 cumulative, if there are valid objections under 403 -- but I 24 can't decide that yet. 25 Anything else? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6380 49UJSAT1 1 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, I think what is going to 2 wind up happening then, the witness will be presented with a 3 copy of the rider of the search warrant which will have to be 4 introduced into evidence, and she will be sitting on the 5 witness stand for an awful long time flipping through the rider 6 thinking about whether a particular document is responsive to 7 the search warrant or not. 8 That seems to be certainly -- 9 THE COURT: We shall see. 10 MR. MORVILLO: I will also add that the court's 11 proposed instruction I think should go a step further and say 12 that documents that are not introduced into evidence, the jury 13 can draw no inference from the fact a document was not 14 introduced into evidence, that it was unlawfully seized. 15 MR. STERN: An instruction like that should await the 16 witness' answers. She may say they were lawfully seized, she 17 may not. That will be the evidence, whatever it is. If she 18 says everything is lawfully seized, then that is what she says. 19 She will look foolish for saying it or not. We will have to 20 await the witness to find that out. 21 THE COURT: All right. Anything else? 22 Who is the first witness? 23 MR. MORVILLO: Christine Monaco, the search witness, 24 your Honor. 25 THE COURT: Why don't we bring the witness in. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6381 49UJSAT1 1 (Pause) 2 (Jury present) 3 THE COURT: Please be seated, all. Good morning, 4 ladies and gentlemen. 5 THE JURY: Good morning. 6 THE COURT: Good to see you all. 7 All right. Mr. Morvillo. 8 MR. MORVILLO: The government calls Christine Monaco. 9 CHRISTINE MONACO, 10 called as a witness by the Government, 11 having been duly sworn, testified as follows: 12 DIRECT EXAMINATION 13 BY MR. MORVILLO: 14 Q. Good morning. 15 A. Good morning. 16 Q. How are you employed? 17 A. I am a special agent with the FBI. 18 Q. What is your position with the FBI? 19 A. I am currently assigned to the domestic terrorism division, 20 WMD squad. 21 Q. WMD, what does that stand for? 22 A. Weapons of mass destruction. 23 MR. TIGAR: Excuse me, your Honor. Might the agent 24 pull the microphone a little closer? I am having a little 25 difficulty hearing. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6382 49UJSAT1 Monaco - direct 1 THE COURT: Yes, please speak into the microphone. 2 BY MR. MORVILLO: 3 Q. How long have you been an FBI agent? 4 A. It will be 8 years this October. 5 Q. In your current position, what do you do? 6 A. I am a special agent assigned to that squad. I am a 7 principal lead supervisor on the squad. 8 Q. What does that mean? 9 A. I oversee squad activities, I take the desk when the 10 current supervisor is not available and not in the office. 11 Q. What do you mean by, "the desk"? 12 A. The desk, basically overseeing the squad activities. When 13 arrests or searches are conducted, I would coordinate those 14 activities. 15 Q. In addition to your responsibilities on your squad, do you 16 have any additional or collateral duties? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. What would those be? 19 A. I am a member of the Evidence Response Team. 20 Q. Is that also known an the ERT? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. What is an Evidence Response Team? 23 A. Team members get additional specialized forensic training 24 with regard to blood, DNA collection, fingerprint collection, 25 ballistic analysis, and we, in turn, will assist squads in SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6383 49UJSAT1 Monaco - direct 1 conducting searches and processing crime scenes. 2 Q. In connection with your responsibilities as a member of the 3 ERT team, have you participated in the execution of search 4 warrants? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Approximately how many? 7 A. Approximately 60. 8 Q. What types of searches have you participated in? 9 A. Standard searches, and what I mean by "standard searches" 10 is seizure of documents or items as well as processing crime 11 scenes, where you would lift fingerprints at a scene, collect 12 blood and DNA, do ballistic analysis. 13 THE COURT: Agent, could you make sure to keep your 14 voice up when you talk into the microphone. 15 THE WITNESS: Certainly. 16 BY MR. MORVILLO: 17 Q. Directing your attention to April 9th of 2002, did you 18 participate in a search on that day? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. In what location did you search on that day? 21 A. It was 305184th Street in East Elmhurst, New York. 22 Q. Did you or some member of your team obtain a search warrant 23 prior to conducting the search? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Did you do anything before beginning the search? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6384 49UJSAT1 Monaco - direct 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. What did you do? 3 A. I had obtained a copy of the search warrant and the 4 accompanying rider to the search warrant, and I reviewed that. 5 Q. What is a rider? 6 A. A rider accompanies a search warrant, and basically it will 7 describe and list the types of items or documentation that you 8 can seize, that agents have a right to seize at the location. 9 Q. Did you do anything else before the search began when you 10 reviewed the rider? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. What did you do? 13 A. The other members of the search team were given an 14 opportunity to review the rider as well. 15 Q. Did there come a time when you proceeded to the location 16 you were going to search? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Did you know anything about that location prior to going 19 there? 20 A. No -- other -- no. There was going to be an arrest that 21 was going to occur prior to us executing the search at the 22 location. 23 Q. Did you know what type of a location you were going to be 24 searching? 25 A. Yes. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6385 49UJSAT1 Monaco - direct 1 Q. What was that? 2 A. A residence. 3 Q. Approximately what time did the search begin? 4 A. I would say approximately 12:00 o'clock. 5 Q. How long did this search last? 6 A. Approximately five hours. 7 Q. So it ended around 5:00 o'clock? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. Approximately how many personnel participated in that 10 search? 11 A. I believe it is 11. 12 Q. Did you have a particular role in the execution of the 13 search warrant of this residence? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. What was that role? 16 A. I was the Evidence Response Team team leader at that 17 location. 18 Q. What does the team leader do? 19 A. I coordinate the assignments of the search team personnel, 20 decide who is going to do what with regard to the search, 21 coordinate and review overall search activities, review the 22 paperwork that is completed at the location with regard to the 23 search, and also complete administrative paperwork myself with 24 regard to the search. 25 Q. What kind of paperwork is prepared at a search? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6386 49UJSAT1 Monaco - direct 1 A. We complete inventory sheets, they're called FD-597's, that 2 is a Bureau term, and FD-192, a Bureau term, and also chain of 3 custody for the items that are seized at a location, so that 4 the individual that is at that particular location will have a 5 listing of the items that were seized. 6 Q. Is it fair to say that the team leader has administrative 7 responsibilities for the search? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. In addition to preparing documentation, how would a team 10 leader, having you as a team leader on this search, allocate 11 personnel? 12 A. I would basically see what needed to be done and allocate 13 the personnel accordingly; photography, sketch, collection 14 being the primary duties of a search. 15 Q. You testified that a search began at approximately noon on 16 April 9th of 2002. Is that correct? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. How did the search begin? 19 In other words, what was the first thing that you did 20 in executing the search warrant? 21 A. Myself and the photographer, Special Agent Mike Polizi, 22 entered the residence and did a walk-through at the residence 23 to get an overall idea of how many rooms were at the location 24 and where we should start our collection efforts. 25 MR. MORVILLO: May I approach, your Honor? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6387 49UJSAT1 Monaco - direct 1 THE COURT: Yes. 2 (Pause) 3 BY MR. MORVILLO: 4 Q. Agent Monaco, I've just handed you what has been marked for 5 identification as Government Exhibit 3536 B. Would you please 6 take a look at that document and let me know if you recognize 7 it? 8 A. Yes. 9 THE COURT: 3536 B? 10 MR. MORVILLO: D, as in David. 11 THE COURT: All right. 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. What is it? 14 A. It is the sketch that was completed on the day of the 15 search of the residence that we searched. 16 Q. Did you complete this sketch? 17 A. No, I did not. 18 Q. During the search, did you personally view all of the areas 19 in the search location that are depicted on the sketch? 20 A. Yes, I did. 21 Q. Does the sketch fairly and accurately depict the size and 22 location of the rooms at the search location? 23 A. The diagram is not to scale, but it accurately depicts the 24 location of the rooms, yes. 25 MR. MORVILLO: The government would offer into SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6388 49UJSAT1 Monaco - direct 1 evidence at this time Government Exhibit 3536 D. 2 MR. STERN: We have no objection. 3 THE COURT: All right. Government Exhibit 3536 D 4 received in evidence. 5 (Government Exhibit 3536 D received in evidence) 6 MR. MORVILLO: May I display a copy of 3536 D to the 7 jury, using the Elmo? 8 THE COURT: Yes. 9 (At this time, Government Exhibit 3536 D, in evidence, 10 was displayed to the jury) 11 BY MR. MORVILLO: 12 Q. Agent Monaco, you may see on the screen before you the 13 first page of Government Exhibit 3536 D, which for the record 14 is a three-page document. In the upper-right-hand corner it 15 says Page 1 of 3? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Do you see that? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. In the upper-left-hand corner there is a box with a 20 description. What information is contained in that box? 21 A. That is the location where the search was conducted, the 22 date of the search, the case identifier is FBI file number for 23 that particular case and preparing assistants, myself and Mike 24 Polizi and Shawn Cavanaugh, Mike being the photographer on the 25 day and Shawn being the preparer of the sketch. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6389 49UJSAT1 Monaco - direct 1 Q. Make sure you speak into the microphone. 2 A. I am sorry. Yes. 3 Q. You said that Agent Cavanaugh prepared the sketch? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. If you touch the screen in front of you, you should get an 6 arrow, and if you could, indicate where the entrance to the 7 residence was. 8 A. (Indicating) 9 Q. A blue dot appeared there? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. Where did you go when you did your walk-through? 12 Please describe the area of the first floor of the 13 residence. 14 A. From what I recall, if you proceed down the foyer, you make 15 a right and you enter the living room area. 16 If you proceed through the living room area, you enter 17 the dining room area. If you make a left, there is a doorway 18 between the dining room and the kitchen. 19 Then if you go down the hallway, there is a staircase 20 to the right of you if you are facing the foyer and you can 21 proceed up the staircase to the second floor of the residence. 22 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, may I display to the jury 23 Page 2 of Government Exhibit 3536 D? 24 THE COURT: Yes. 25 BY MR. MORVILLO: SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6390 49UJSAT1 Monaco - direct 1 Q. If you can continue your description of the search 2 location, Agent Monaco, on the screen. I have placed Page 2 of 3 3 of Government Exhibit 3536 D. 4 A. Proceeding up the staircase onto the second floor, on the 5 left-hand side is one of the bathrooms. If you proceed further 6 down the second floor hall, you're going to be entering a 7 bedroom, which we labeled Bedroom 1. 8 When you enter Bedroom 1, there was one closet, from 9 what I recall, on the right-hand side of the doorway. 10 If you proceed further down the second floor hallway, 11 you're going to enter a second bedroom, which we labeled 12 Bedroom No. 2. 13 If you are in the doorway, facing Bedroom 2, to the 14 left would be a closet. If you proceed further down the second 15 floor hallway, you're going to be entering what we labeled an 16 office, and facing the doorway -- pardon me -- when you're 17 entering the doorway and entering into the office, there is a 18 closet space to the right. 19 Q. Incidentally, Agent Monaco, prior to conducting the search, 20 did you know whose residence this was? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Who was it? 23 A. It was Mr. Yousry's. 24 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, may I place on the Elmo 25 Government Exhibit 3536 D, Page 3? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6391 49UJSAT1 Monaco - direct 1 THE COURT: Yes. 2 BY MR. MORVILLO: 3 Q. Agent Monaco, what does this sketch depict? 4 A. The basement of the residence. 5 Q. Did you also do a walk-through of the basement? 6 A. I did. 7 Q. Would you describe that to the jury. 8 A. My recollection is based on the diagram primarily for the 9 basement. We proceed down the stairs, and you'll enter one of 10 what appeared to be two rooms in the basement area. There is 11 one closet to the right in Room 1. Room 1 has a doorway where 12 you can proceed into Room 2, and in Room 2 there is a bathroom 13 and closet space. 14 (Continued on next page) 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6392 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 Q. As you were making this walk-through, what were your 2 objectives, if any? 3 A. Our objectives were to basically assess the actual 4 residence and to determine where we were going to start our 5 collection efforts for the search, where we were going to 6 concentrate on manpower. 7 Q. Based on that walk-through, did you come to any 8 conclusions? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. And what were those conclusions? 11 A. It appeared that we should focus initially on the second 12 floor, the office, and one of the bedrooms. 13 Q. What did you base that conclusion on? 14 A. The amount of documentation in those particular rooms and 15 particularly with regard to the office. 16 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, may I approach again? 17 THE COURT: Yes. 18 Q. Agent Monaco, I've just handed you a stack of photographs 19 that have been marked for identification as Government Exhibit 20 2301A through R. Can you take a moment to flip through those 21 photographs and let me know whether you recognize them? 22 A. Yes, I do. 23 Q. And what are they? 24 A. These are photographs that were taken of the residence that 25 we searched that day. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6393 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, at this time -- 2 Q. Have you reviewed those prior to your testimony here today? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Do these photographs fairly and accurately depict the 5 location, how it appeared at the time that you conducted the 6 search? 7 A. Yes. 8 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, the government would offer 9 Government Exhibit its 2301A through 2301R. 10 MR. STERN: No objection. 11 THE COURT: Government Exhibits 2301A through R 12 received in evidence. 13 (Government's Exhibits 2301A-2301R received in 14 evidence) 15 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, may I retrieve the 16 photographs from the agent and publish them to the jury? 17 THE COURT: Yes. 18 Q. Agent Monaco, I am going to place the photographs one at a 19 time on the Elmo, and I would ask you to describe what you see 20 in relation to the sketch that you just testified about. 21 I have placed Government Exhibit 2301A on the screen. 22 Do you recognize that? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. What is that? 25 A. That is a photograph of the entrance of the residence. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6394 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 Q. And this is on the screen now as 2301B. What is that? 2 A. That's a photograph of a portion of the living room. 3 Q. And where in relation to this photograph is the entrance? 4 A. The entrance would be to the left of the couch. 5 Q. And where do you go if you proceed through the doorway to 6 the right of the couch? 7 A. You're going to be proceeding into the dining room area. 8 Q. Government 2301C is now on the screen. What does that 9 depict? 10 A. That's a portion of the living room. 11 Q. 2301B? 12 A. That's a portion of the dining room area. 13 Q. Viewed from where? 14 A. You would be in between the living room and the dining room 15 to take that picture. 16 Q. 2301E? 17 A. That's a portion of the dining room area. You would be 18 taking the picture in the dining room. 19 Q. 2301F? 20 A. That's a portion of the dining room area. You would also 21 be taking the photo from the dining room. 22 Q. 2301G? 23 A. That's a portion of the kitchen. 24 Q. And 2301H? 25 A. That is the staircase leading up to the second floor. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6395 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 Q. If you were standing at the base of the staircase and 2 turned around 180 degrees, what would you be facing? 3 A. The entrance. 4 Q. To the residence? 5 A. To the residence, yes. 6 Q. 2301I? 7 A. That's a portion of the second floor hallway. 8 Q. Is this as you found it on that day? 9 A. Yes, I believe so. 10 Q. Which direction, based on this sketch, are you looking 11 here? 12 A. The staircase is to the right of you and the room that is 13 straight ahead would be the office, I believe. 14 Q. So the bedrooms would be to the left? 15 A. Both bedrooms would be to the left, yes. 16 Q. Exhibit 2301J is on the screen. Do you recognize that? 17 A. Yes. That's a portion of the office. 18 Q. Viewed from the hallway? 19 A. You would be taking the photo from the hallway, yes. 20 Q. 2301K? 21 A. That's a portion of the office. 22 Q. 2301L? 23 A. Portion of the office. 24 Q. 2301M? 25 A. That's a portion of the office. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6396 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 Q. 2301N, as in Nancy? 2 A. That's a portion of the office. 3 Q. 2301O? 4 A. That's a portion of the office. 5 Q. Government Exhibit 2301P? 6 A. That's a photo of a chair in the office and items found on 7 that chair. 8 Q. Were those items there when you arrived at the search? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Do you know who placed those items there? 11 A. I believe the items were placed by Mr. Yousry. 12 Q. Do you know why Mr. Yousry placed them there? 13 A. I believe that he was asked by agents what might be 14 relevant items with regard to their investigation, and he 15 placed those items there for us to take. 16 Q. Government Exhibit 2301Q? 17 A. That's a portion of the bedroom. I believe we labeled it 18 bedroom 2. 19 Q. Do you know whether that was the master bedroom or another 20 bedroom? 21 A. Master bedroom. 22 Q. And, finally, Government Exhibit 2301R, do you recognize 23 that? 24 A. Yes. That's the dining room table and a photograph of 25 the -- a copy of the search warrant and the inventory sheets SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6397 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 left for the individuals that resided at the house. 2 Q. Is that the FD597 that you referred to before? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. What information is contained on the FD597s? 5 A. Excuse me? 6 Q. What information is contained on the FD597s? 7 A. They are inventory sheets. They provide a description of 8 items seized and where they were seized. 9 Q. Is it standard procedure to leave a copy of those when you 10 exit a search location? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. Now, you testified a moment ago, Agent Monaco, that 13 following your walk-through you made the determination to 14 concentrate initially your search efforts in the second floor 15 office? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Is that correct? 18 Why did you determine that the second floor office was 19 where you should concentrate your efforts? 20 A. There was a voluminous amount of documentation and items in 21 that particular space. 22 Q. How many personnel did you allocate as the team leader to 23 search in the office, if you can recall? 24 A. Probably would be best to review the paperwork that I 25 completed on that day, but let me think. I think we had four SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6398 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 available from the onset of the search. 2 Q. Which document in particular would help you to refresh your 3 recollection? 4 A. I completed an administrative log. 5 Q. Would that be an administrative worksheet? 6 A. Yes. 7 MR. MORVILLO: May I approach, your Honor? 8 THE COURT: Yes. 9 Agent Monaco, please keep your voice up, talk into the 10 microphone. 11 Q. Agent Monaco, I have just placed before you Government 12 Exhibit 3536C, as in Charlie, and I would ask you to take a 13 look at that and read it to yourself and let me know whether 14 that, after reading it, refreshes your recollection? 15 A. Yes, it does. 16 Q. Without reading from the document, now that your 17 recollection has been refreshed, how many agents did you 18 allocate to search in the office at that time, if you recall? 19 A. Initially, five, and that's including myself. 20 Q. Do you recall who or what type of personnel assisted you in 21 the initial search of the office? 22 A. Special agents and one language specialist. 23 Q. Why did you have a language specialist? 24 A. We needed to have someone available to translate in the 25 Arabic language for us. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6399 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 Q. Why was that? 2 A. None of the agents present, including myself, know Arabic. 3 Q. And what percentage, if you can estimate, of the 4 documentation that you encountered in that office was in the 5 Arabic language? 6 A. 65 to 70 percent. 60 percent. 7 Q. Could you generally describe the types of documentation 8 that you found in the second floor office? 9 A. Books, textbooks, files of documents, reports, mailings, 10 newspapers. 11 Q. Were there any boxes in the office? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. Can you describe to the jury how the processing, the search 14 of the office was conducted by yourself? 15 A. Basically, we relied heavily on the language specialist. 16 She would assist the collectors that were available, agent 17 collectors that were available to review items that were in the 18 Arabic language, and attempt to give a translation, to 19 translate, and make a determination what that particular 20 document -- the content of that particular document. 21 Q. And can you describe for the jury how you approached each 22 particular area within the office? 23 A. Additionally, that language specialist had knowledge of the 24 case itself and the investigation, which the other agents 25 present and myself did not have. So in addition to being able SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6400 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 to translate items in a foreign language, she would also be 2 able to tell perhaps if certain items would be of investigative 3 value. So upon reviewing certain items she would deem them of 4 value or not, and we would make the determination to collect 5 them. 6 Q. She would describe the documents to you? 7 A. Yes. She wasn't exclusively making the determination on 8 each item found in the room. There were items in the English 9 language and the agents themselves could make the determination 10 whether it should be collected. 11 We also utilized the assistance of one search team 12 member, special agent Bill Davitch, who was a member of the 13 case squad and was familiar with the investigation as well, and 14 he assisted us in determining which documents would be 15 responsive to the search warrant. 16 Q. Is it unusual to participate in a search where you're not 17 familiar with the investigation? 18 A. Not completely unusual. It is not common. Somewhere in 19 between. 20 Q. When you say that you would show documents to the language 21 specialist, who was the language specialist? 22 MR. STERN: The screen just broke down after beeping. 23 MR. RUHNKE: I'm guessing it is unplugged. 24 (Pause) 25 THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, the technology SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6401 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 problem has been solved. Let me just tell you to remind you 2 about something which I've explained before as long as an issue 3 arose with respect to the technology. There are various 4 screens around the courtroom. There is the screen, the big 5 screen. They are the screens in front of you and all of the 6 parties and the Court have those screens. Those are the 7 screens on which you will see the documents and other materials 8 received in evidence. 9 The computer screens that you see around the courtroom 10 and that you don't have access to that are not played for you 11 is the transcript of what's going on which the reporter takes 12 down, and that appears on the screens which the parties and the 13 Court see. That's one method by which the record is taken. 14 There are also, as you see the court reporter 15 physically takes down in the record both in the computer and in 16 the reporter's notes, which are always kept, so we have 17 essentially two systems going on at the same time. 18 In the course of your deliberations, as I've told you, 19 if at any time you wish to have any part of the transcript, you 20 can ask for any part of the transcript in the course of 21 deliberations. 22 Mr. Morvillo, you may proceed. 23 BY MR. MORVILLO: 24 Q. Incidentally, Agent Monaco, do you recall the name of the 25 language specialist who assisted you in the search? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6402 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. Who was that? 3 A. Nabila Banout. 4 Q. The language specialist in connection with the search, can 5 you describe how you would interact with her? 6 A. She would interact with the agent collectors in a room, and 7 she would assist them in reviewing documentation. She would 8 take a look at pages, books that needed to have some 9 translation and be able to get -- be able to digest a portion 10 of that particular document to do a quick translation. And 11 also based on her knowledge of the investigation itself, assist 12 in making a determination if that particular document or book 13 was going to be seized ultimately. 14 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, may I redisplay for the 15 jury Government Exhibit 2301L? 16 THE COURT: Yes. 17 Q. Agent Monaco, I've put on the Elmo Government Exhibit 2301L 18 in evidence. This is a document you previously -- photograph 19 you previously testified was taken in the office on the second 20 floor? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Is that correct? 23 Do you see towards the middle and bottom of the 24 photograph there are some boxes there? 25 A. Yes. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6403 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 Q. Could you describe for the jury how you would conduct a 2 search of those boxes? 3 A. An agent collector would open that box. He himself or 4 herself would review the documents in that box. If they needed 5 assistance in translation, Nabila would go over and assist in 6 translating in the box. Special Agent Davitch, who was a 7 member of the case squad and had knowledge of the case, would 8 also help assist in reviewing the documents, and then a 9 decision was made to seize. 10 Q. Or not to seize? 11 A. Or not to seize. 12 Q. Did you take everything? Did you seize everything in the 13 office? 14 A. No. 15 Q. Approximately what percentage of the materials in the 16 office do you think you seized? 17 A. Approximately 40 percent. 18 Q. Did you seize any of these boxes here? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. And what process did you use to review -- did you review 21 any of the boxes at the search? 22 A. I do recall reviewing some of the boxes. 23 Q. Did you look at every single document in each box? 24 A. No. 25 Q. How would you make a determination as to whether to seize SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6404 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 the entire box or not? 2 A. Agent collectors attempted to review as many documents as 3 possible in a box. If a substantial portion of the documents 4 in the box were deemed pertinent, then we were going to take 5 the box. 6 Q. In conducting a search and as a case agent is it important 7 for you to know where a particular document was seized from or 8 particular item seized during a search? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Why is that? 11 A. It assists ultimately in the investigation to know where an 12 item was found that we deemed pertinent. 13 Q. Did you seize any books that day when you were in the 14 second floor office? 15 A. Yes. 16 THE COURT: Please keep your voice up. 17 Q. Why did you seize -- 18 THE COURT: Talk into the microphone. It may be 19 helpful to bring your chair forward toward the microphone. 20 Great. Thank you. 21 Q. Why did you seize books that day? 22 A. Upon reviewing the books, there were books that were deemed 23 of investigative value. 24 Q. When you say of investigative value, does that relate to 25 the search warrant? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6405 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. In what sense? 3 A. That the rider which accompanies the search warrant and 4 gives a description of the items that we can seize, when we 5 look at a particular book, it will fall within the descriptions 6 on the search rider. 7 Q. Approximately do you know how many boxes of evidence you 8 seized during the course of this search on this day? 9 A. I think it was approximately 20 boxes, maybe over 20, a 10 little over 20. 11 Q. Did you personally review every piece of evidence that was 12 seized during the course of the search? 13 A. No. 14 Q. Were you involved in the seizure of every piece of 15 evidence? 16 A. No. 17 Q. Did you fill out paperwork with respect to each box of 18 evidence seized from the search? 19 A. Most of the items, I believe, yes. 20 Q. And was that something that you did in your capacity as a 21 team leader? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. What other types of items did you seize other than 24 documents and books? 25 A. I recall we seized videotapes and cassette tapes from the SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6406 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 office. 2 Q. When you were at the search scene, if you recall, how did 3 you make a determination if a document or a book was in the 4 English language that it was responsive to the search warrant? 5 A. If a document or book in the English language -- again, you 6 rely on the agent collectors having reviewed the rider and the 7 description of the items that we can seize. We would see if a 8 particular item fell within what the rider allowed. If we 9 needed a little bit more assistance, Special Agent Davitch and 10 the language specialist, Nabila, would assist the collectors in 11 making a determination. 12 Q. Did you actually read the books as you sat there? 13 A. Not in their entirety, no. 14 Q. What would you do when you came across a book that you were 15 examining? 16 A. Title, perhaps -- again, this is generally. Look at the 17 index or the table of contents. 18 MR. RUHNKE: Your Honor, could we ask that the agent 19 pull the microphone actually in front of her? We can't hear. 20 THE WITNESS: I have a cold, too. 21 THE COURT: Yes. 22 MR. RUHNKE: Thank you. 23 THE COURT: I think if you move it in front of you and 24 lift the microphone -- tilt it towards you. Thank you. 25 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, may I place before the jury SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6407 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 Government Exhibit 2301N in evidence? 2 THE COURT: Yes. 3 Q. Agent Monaco, Government Exhibit 23N in evidence -- 4 THE COURT: 2301N. 5 Q. I'm sorry. 2301N in evidence is now before you. 6 You testified previously that that is also a 7 photograph of the office on the second floor? 8 A. A portion of the office, yes. 9 Q. Directing your attention to this area here, I am going to 10 put a circle. Do you see that area of the search which is -- I 11 would describe it on top of a file cabinet. 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. Can you describe for the jury how you as an agent would 14 approach searching an area like that? 15 A. You would take those documents. If they were in the 16 English language you can review them yourself. You scan the 17 documents. Easily you can make the determination based on 18 reviewing the rider to the search warrant to seize the item you 19 want. If you needed help with translation you would call a 20 translator over. Or if you needed additional assistance 21 because you didn't have a greater knowledge of the case itself, 22 if there is a member of the case squad available at the 23 location, you would speak with them. Sometimes it requires 24 trying to make a phone call and reach somebody for assistance. 25 You try as best you can to make a determination whether to SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6408 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 seize the document or not. 2 Q. You testified that the search took approximately five 3 hours? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Given the volume of materials, how much time did you have 6 to make a decision with respect to each document that you 7 decided to seize? 8 A. Not a lot of time. 9 Q. This search occurred in April of 2002, is that right? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. And you've testified that you had no involvement with this 12 case since that time? 13 A. No. 14 Q. Do you have a recollection as you sit here today of every 15 item that was seized during the course of that search? 16 A. No. 17 Q. Once the search was concluded after five hours, how did the 18 search end? What steps were taken to conclude the search? 19 A. Special Agent Mike Pollizzi, who was the photographer on 20 the search team, would take what we call exit photos of every 21 room of the residence so that you have photographs of the 22 residence as we left it. 23 In the meantime, the agent collectors, as well as 24 myself and any other manpower we have available, will assist in 25 placing the documents in the boxes, making sure that the boxes SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6409 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 are appropriately marked and cataloged, and assist in overall 2 documentation of the search. 3 Q. What did you do with the boxes of documents when the search 4 concluded? 5 A. The boxes of documents were turned over to the custody of 6 Special Agent Davitch. 7 Q. And at that point in time did your involvement in the 8 search end? 9 A. Yes. It took me a day to complete the paperwork that I 10 needed to complete and return that to the case squad. 11 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, may I have a moment to 12 confer with counsel? 13 THE COURT: Sure. 14 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, I have no further questions 15 for this witness. I would just request permission to read a 16 stipulation that's been signed by all the parties to the jury. 17 THE COURT: All right. 18 MR. MORVILLO: It does not have an exhibit label. Let 19 me just get a number, your Honor. Sorry. 20 Your Honor, this is Government Exhibit 2300S. I don't 21 have a label on it, but I have written on it and we will place 22 a label on it when we have an opportunity. 23 May I read it to the jury? 24 THE COURT: Yes. 25 MR. MORVILLO: And display it on the Elmo? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6410 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 THE COURT: Yes. 2 Government Exhibit 2300S received in evidence. 3 (Government's Exhibit 2300S received in evidence) 4 MR. MORVILLO: The paries hereby stipulate and agree 5 that the following people would testify as follows if called as 6 witnesses at this trial: 7 1. Special agent William Davitch of the Federal 8 Bureau of Investigation ("FBI") would testify, that on April 9, 9 2002, he was present during the search of defendant Yousry's 10 residence at 30-51 84th Street, East Elmhurst, New York. 11 Special Agent Davitch would further testify that, after the 12 search concluded, Special Agent Christine Monaco transferred to 13 him custody of all of the materials seized during the search 14 ("the seized materials") and that, in his vehicle, he then 15 transported the seized materials to FBI's New York field office 16 at 26 Federal Plaza, New York, New York. Special Agent Davitch 17 would further testify that, when he arrived at 26 Federal 18 Plaza, he transported the seized materials to a secure, locked 19 evidence-storage room for secure storage. 20 2. Special Agent Kimberly Whittle of the Federal 21 Bureau of Investigation would testify that, following the 22 seizure and transportation to the FBI of the seized materials, 23 she took possession of the seized materials and prepared a 24 detailed inventory of the seized materials. Special Agent 25 Whittle would further testify that the seized materials did not SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6411 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 leave the secure custody and control of the FBI after April 9, 2 2002. Special Agent Whittle would further testify that: 3 A. Government exhibits 2305-1 and 2307-1, and all 4 government exhibits in the 2312 series and the 2313 series are 5 from a box identified by Special Agent Monaco as containing 6 "miscellaneous documents, notebooks, and photos found on black 7 chair" in the office -- 8 THE COURT: Could you just go slower? 9 MR. MORVILLO: I'm sorry, your Honor. 10 THE COURT: Go slower. Thank you. 11 MR. MORVILLO: I'll start that paragraph again. 12 A. Government Exhibits 2305-1 and 2307-1, and all 13 government exhibits in the 2312 series and the 2313 series are 14 from a box identified by Special Agent Monaco as containing 15 "miscellaneous documents, notebooks, and photos found on black 16 chair" in the office on the second floor of defendant Yousry's 17 residence at 30-51 84th Street, East Elmhurst, New York. More 18 specifically: 19 1. Government Exhibit 2305-1 was found on the black 20 chair inside a composition style notebook labeled "Legal Notes 21 5 Sheikh Omar Abdel Rahman;" 22 2. Government Exhibit 2307-1 was found on the black 23 chair inside a composition style notebook labeled "Omar Abdel 24 Rahman Legal Notes;" 25 3. Government Exhibits in the 2312 series were found SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6412 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 on the black chair in between the front and back cover of an 2 unbound notebook labeled "Legal Notes 6 Sheikh Omar Abdel 3 Rahman;" 4 4. Government Exhibits in the 2313 series were found 5 among loose papers. 6 B. Government Exhibits in the 2405 series are from a 7 box identified by Special Agent Monaco as a "white Staples box 8 containing miscellaneous documents" found in the office on the 9 second floor of defendant Yousry's residence at 30-51 84th 10 Street, East Elmhurst, New York, and further identified by 11 Special Agent Monaco as having been marked by her as "Box No. 12 5." 13 C. Government Exhibits in the 2406 series are from a 14 box identified by Special Agent Monaco as a "white Staples box 15 containing miscellaneous documents found in the office on the 16 second floor of defendant Yousry's residence at 30-51 84th 17 Street, East Elmhurst, New York, and further identified by 18 Special Agent Monaco as having been marked by her as Box No. 1. 19 D. Government Exhibits in the 2415 series are from a 20 box identified by Special Agent Christine Monaco as containing 21 "miscellaneous items" found in the office on the second floor 22 of defendant Yousry's residence at 30-51 84th Street, East 23 Elmhurst, New York. 24 E. Government Exhibits in the 2421 series are from a 25 box identified by Special Agent Monaco as a "white Staples box SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6413 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 containing miscellaneous documents found in the office on the 2 second floor of defendant Yousry's residence at 30-51 84th 3 Street, East Elmhurst, New York, and further identified by 4 Special Agent Monaco as having been marked by her as Box No. 3. 5 F. Government Exhibit 2422-1 is from a box identified 6 by Special Agent Christine Monaco as containing miscellaneous 7 documentation found on a two-drawer dresser in the office on 8 the second floor of defendant Yousry's residence at 30-51 84th 9 Street, East Elmhurst, New York, New York. 10 The parties further stipulate and agree that the 11 government exhibits listed and described above may be admitted 12 into evidence. 13 Agreed to and stipulated and signed by all the 14 parties, dated today. 15 THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, this is a convenient 16 time for us to take our mid-morning break. We will break for 17 10 minutes. 18 Please remember my continuing instructions not to talk 19 about the case. Always remember to keep an open mind. 20 All rise, please, and you can -- I usually wait for 21 Mr. Fletcher. The jury can follow Mr. Fletcher to the jury 22 room. 23 (Jury not present) 24 THE COURT: See you shortly. 25 (Recess) SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6414 49UMSAT2 Monaco - direct 1 THE COURT: Let's bring in the jury. 2 MR. STERN: Judge, may I stand at the podium? 3 THE COURT: Yes, please. 4 (Jury present) 5 THE COURT: Mr. Stern, you may examine. 6 MR. STERN: Thank you. 7 THE COURT: Hold on one moment. The witness is on the 8 stand. 9 Mr. Fletcher. 10 THE DEPUTY CLERK: Special Agent Monaco, you are 11 reminded you are still under oath. 12 THE WITNESS: Yes. 13 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, may I confer with Mr. Stern 14 very briefly before we begin? 15 THE COURT: Yes. 16 CROSS-EXAMINATION 17 BY MR. STERN: 18 Q. Agent Monaco, you have been a special agent for some time, 19 haven't you? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. And to become a special agent you receive training, right? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. And you receive training in many different areas of what it 24 takes to ultimately become an agent, right? 25 A. Yes. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6415 49UMSAT2 Monaco - cross 1 Q. And at this time in your career you work on the evidence 2 recovery team, fair to say? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. And you receive training specific to that area of work, 5 don't you? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. You receive training on what to look for during a search? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. How to do a search safely? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. How to do a search thoroughly? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. How to catalog evidence appropriately? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. Chain of custody? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Warrants and how to execute warrants? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. The meaning of warrants? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. All of those kinds of things are covered by your specific 22 training, right? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. In addition to that training, you've had on-the-job 25 training since you've done 60 some searches, right? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6416 49UMSAT2 Monaco - cross 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. So it is fair to say that you have quite a bit of expertise 3 in that particular area, isn't it? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Now, there is a protocol that's usually followed before one 6 begins or goes to do a search of a residence, isn't there? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. And in this case that protocol was followed, right? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Your connection with this case began on April 8, the day 11 before the search actually took place, didn't it? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. You had an initial arrest and search team leader briefing 14 that day, correct? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. And at that briefing the people who were going to be 17 involved in the search, in your case the team leader was you, 18 right? 19 A. Yes. I was the only person present on the search team for 20 the briefing. 21 Q. Who was giving the briefing? 22 A. I believe it was the then supervisor of the case squad. 23 Q. And typically that briefing also has a case agent, doesn't 24 it? 25 A. Yes. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6417 49UMSAT2 Monaco - cross 1 Q. But the case agent wasn't present at this meeting, was she? 2 A. No. 3 Q. Who was that case agent? 4 A. Special Agent Kimberly Whittle. 5 Q. So there was very little information provided to you at 6 that meeting, correct? 7 A. Specific to our search location, yes. 8 Q. To this particular search, not general information. There 9 was very little? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. And you were given, however, a number of evidence recovery 12 team personnel who they thought would be necessary for this 13 search, right? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. And you were told that they would need two evidence 16 recovery team members, right? 17 A. They advised me that they wished to have two. 18 Q. That was someone's opinion based on information they had 19 about this particular search, right? 20 A. I believe so, yes. 21 Q. And they told you you probably need a translator, correct? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. Because you knew that a lot of the information would be in 24 a language other than English; Arabic? 25 A. The case squad knew, yes. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6418 49UMSAT2 Monaco - cross 1 Q. They sent someone to watch the area, correct? 2 A. I don't know if a member of the case squad sent someone to 3 the area. 4 Q. I don't mean prior to the search. I mean when you were 5 going to actually do the search, you have someone to watch the 6 perimeter of the area to make sure the agents doing the search 7 are kept safe? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. And you planned for all these things? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. And the next day you had another meeting shortly before the 12 time the search was to take place, correct? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. You got together at 7:30, right? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. The members of the team were there? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. You say yes hesitantly. 19 A. I wanted to make sure everyone was there at 7:30. Yes. 20 Q. And you tried again to get information about the case, 21 correct? 22 A. At 7:30, yes. 23 Q. And one of the things you did as part of your protocol was 24 that you examined the warrant to make sure the warrant you had 25 was accurate, right? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6419 49UMSAT2 Monaco - cross 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. And that's because you understand the importance of a 3 warrant, don't you? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. It has to have the correct address? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. Has to describe the things to be seized? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. It has to be signed by a judge of some federal court or 10 another? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. And so you did examine this warrant, right? 13 A. I did. 14 Q. And this warrant that you had at 7:30 in the morning was 15 not accurate, was it? 16 A. No. 17 Q. The address on that warrant was not for Mr. Yousry's home, 18 was it? 19 A. No. 20 Q. It was for some completely different home that had nothing 21 to do with this case? 22 A. It was not Mr. Yousry's home, no. 23 Q. Did you ever search that home? 24 A. No. 25 Q. Did anyone ever tell you that home had anything to do with SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6420 49UMSAT2 Monaco - cross 1 this case? 2 A. No. 3 Q. You weren't the one who had gone to a judge to get that 4 warrant, were you? 5 A. No. 6 Q. Who had gone and gotten that warrant from a judge? 7 A. I believe it was Special Agent Whittle. 8 Q. When you saw that that was wrong, you knew you had to do 9 something about it, right? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. Because you couldn't just say, well, it is wrong, we will 12 enter the home we think we should. You had to present it to a 13 judge and get the judge's permission to enter a particular 14 home? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. So someone went back again? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. They went to the judge? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. They said, judge, this is the right address this time? 21 A. I believe so, yes. 22 Q. And you believed that because they came back with a warrant 23 that had an accurate address on it, correct? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Now, during this meeting you met with, among other people, SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6421 49UMSAT2 Monaco - cross 1 Agent Whittle, didn't you? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. And you tried to get information from Agent Whittle about 4 what should be done at the search, correct? 5 A. I tried to get additional information about what we may 6 find at the location, yes. 7 (Continued on next page) 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6422 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 Q. When you say "what we may find," for example, how many 2 people might be there, correct? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Whether or not there might be pets there that would be 5 dangerous to you? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. What, if anything, they knew about the individual whose 8 home you were going to search? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Was Agent Whittle able to give you accurate information of 11 that sort? 12 A. Some accurate, some not. 13 Q. Well, when you asked Agent Whittle for your information, is 14 it fair to say she either didn't answer you or give you wrong 15 answers? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. So when you ask, for example, about the number of people in 18 the family, she answered you, and the answer was incorrect, 19 wasn't it? 20 A. We ultimately determined it to be incorrect, yes. 21 Q. When you asked her about the number of pets in the home, 22 she answered you, and the answer was incorrect, wasn't it? 23 A. We ultimately determined, yes, it was. 24 Q. Did she give you other information about the home; for 25 example, did she tell you Mr. Yousry was an academic? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6423 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 A. She did, yes. 2 Q. Did she tell you that he was working on a dissertation on 3 the Islamic Group? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Did she tell you whether she had been in his home before? 6 A. It did not seem as if she had knowledge of the home. 7 Q. Did she tell you whether she expected to uncover a large 8 amount of material or a small amount of material when you 9 entered the home? 10 A. She did not say. 11 Q. Did she tell you whether or not she had spoken to 12 Mr. Yousry in the past? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. Now, when you went to the home and went in, there was no 15 problem actually entering the home, was there? 16 A. No. 17 Q. You told us already about generally what the home looked 18 like, right? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Is it fair to say, other than having a whole lot of stuff 21 in his office, there was nothing peculiar about that house, was 22 there? 23 A. No. 24 Q. That is, you didn't find any secret hiding places in the 25 house? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6424 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 A. No. 2 Q. You didn't find any weapons in the house? 3 A. No. 4 Q. All you recollect of what you collected in the search 5 consisted of documents, books and audiotapes and videotapes. 6 Is that fair to say? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Your job as a team leader is what? 9 A. I assigned the manpower that we have available to 10 respective duties with regard to the search. I oversee the 11 actual activities that occur during the search, the actual 12 collection. 13 I review documentation that is completed with regard 14 to the search, and I complete administrative paperwork as well. 15 Q. One of the things you say you did was to go over what you 16 called the rider to the warrant yourself and with other people, 17 right? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. That is because your rider to the warrant is the part of 20 the document that gives you and the people working with you the 21 authority to seize particular documents, right? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. And you may seize whatever is described in that rider, 24 right? 25 A. Yes. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6425 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 Q. And you may not seize anything not described in the rider? 2 A. Certainly, yes. 3 Q. So it was important both that you understand it and that 4 all of the people working with you understand it, right? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Because they were going to have to make determinations as 7 they examined the information as to which fit within the 8 rider -- and by "the rider," I mean all the things enumerated 9 in the rider and which things did not fit? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. One of the people working with you was an interpreter, 12 right? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. That was I think you said Nabila Banout? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. And she, too, had to understand what fit within that rider 17 and what did not, correct? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. Because I think you said that you intended to rely on her 20 in part to help you make decisions as to what should be seized 21 and what should not be seized? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. And you knew, did you not, she had been working on this 24 case for some time prior to the day of that search? 25 A. Yes. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6426 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 Q. And you also knew about her, there would be many, many 2 things that none of you could read? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. And you wanted to be careful that when you're seizing 5 things, you only seize those things, whether they were English 6 or Arabic, that fit within the rider, correct? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. So you went with Ms. Banout, right? 9 A. Excuse me? 10 Q. You entered the home with Ms. Banout? 11 A. I did not enter with her, no. 12 Q. Did she come sometime after you? 13 A. No. She was at the location I believe already when the 14 search team had gotten there. There was an arrest that was 15 conducted prior to the search team arriving. 16 Q. She was already in the home when you arrived? 17 A. I believe so. 18 Q. You also had a photographer, and his name was -- 19 A. Special Agent Polizi. 20 Q. He went around taking pictures of things, right? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. That is to document the way you find things? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. And where you find things? 25 A. Yes. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6427 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 Q. So that anyone looking at those photos knows what the place 2 looked like before the search, right? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. That is because doing the search sometimes disturbs a home 5 in one way or another? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. Things get moved from Point A to Point B, and you don't 8 know which of those things might have significance later on in 9 the case, right? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. So you document each and every part of the home prior to 12 the actual search taking place? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. And those were photographs we saw a few minutes ago, right? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Now, when you went through the home, you had to reach your 17 own determination as to which areas looked most promising to 18 search, right? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. But that didn't mean, did it, you weren't going to search 21 the whole home? 22 A. No. 23 Q. Because it is fair to say, isn't it, the standard FBI 24 search is to maintain the integrity of the evidence, right? 25 A. Yes. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6428 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 Q. To search all rooms thoroughly? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. To properly package seized items? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. And to thoroughly and correctly complete search 6 documentation? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. And those things were done in this case, weren't they? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Each and every room was searched? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. Each and everything you thought fit the rider to the 13 warrant was seized? 14 A. As best we could, to the best of our efforts, yes. 15 Q. And each and every thing that did not fit the rider to the 16 warrant was left alone, right? 17 A. Again, to the best of our efforts, yes. 18 Q. Now, Ms. Banout's role was to convey to you information you 19 couldn't otherwise have access to, right? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. So if there was a book with an Arabic title, she would tell 22 you -- would tell a member of the team what it said, right? 23 A. There were instances when she did actually do a 24 translation, verbally relay it to a collector or myself, and 25 then there were instances where she would do a translation, but SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6429 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 then just make the determination this appears to be an 2 investigative value to the case, you should take something like 3 this. 4 Q. You're aware, aren't you, Ms. Banout is not an agent? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. And you're aware that she doesn't have the extensive 7 training agents get? 8 A. She doesn't receive the same training as us, no. 9 Q. Nowhere near? 10 She is really just an interpreter, right? 11 A. Not just an interpreter, but she has knowledge of the cases 12 that she assists in providing translation for. 13 Q. Did you know, when you had her do this, what training she 14 had in the meaning of warrants? 15 A. No. 16 Q. Did you know, when you were having her do this, how many 17 decisions about what fit a rider warrant or not she had made in 18 the past? 19 A. No. 20 Q. So as far as you knew, her real expertise was as an 21 interpreter, right? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. Nonetheless, there were times when she would say take 24 something, and without knowing what it really said in 25 English -- that is, in a translation -- you would just take it SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6430 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 based on her word it might have relevance to the case? 2 MR. MORVILLO: Objection. 3 THE COURT: Basis? 4 MR. MORVILLO: Hearsay, your Honor. 5 THE COURT: Overruled. 6 A. There were instances where we would take it because she had 7 advised it would be of investigative value, and there were also 8 instances when we would ask for the assistance of Special Agent 9 Davitch, a member of the case squad, also there with knowledge 10 of the case. 11 Q. I am focusing on the instances where she would say it had 12 investigative value. I am asking you, did that happen without 13 her interpreting or translating what it said or were any agents 14 present? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. You would just rely on her word for that? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. I am going to show you, with the court's permission, one of 19 these photographs, 2301 B. Those are the notebooks you 20 ascribed as being found on a black chair, correct? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. It is your understanding those notebooks were given by 23 Mr. Yousry to another agent when they came to arrest him, 24 right? 25 A. Yes. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6431 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 Q. And they were given to him, it is your understanding, in 2 response to a question about what he thought would be of value 3 to them? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. So although those were photographed there, you don't know 6 where they originally came from, do you? 7 A. No. 8 Q. When you entered his office -- 9 THE COURT: I am sorry? 10 (Pause) 11 THE COURT: All right. Okay. Why don't you pick up 12 with your question, Mr. Stern. 13 If the reporter would read back the last question and 14 answer and the last question which was begun. 15 (Record read) 16 THE COURT: All right. 17 BY MR. STERN: 18 Q. When you entered his office, it was filled with books and 19 papers and boxes, right? 20 A. Yes. 21 MR. STERN: With the court's permission, I am going to 22 show you a photograph marked 2301 L in evidence, alright? 23 THE COURT: Yes. 24 BY MR. STERN: 25 Q. That is a photograph of one corner of the office, isn't it? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6432 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. Can you read the names of any of the books in that 3 photograph? 4 A. Maybe one. 5 Q. Let's start with, look at a book in the bottom corner above 6 the mug. Can you read the title of that book? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. What is that book? 9 A. "The Arab World." 10 Q. How about the black book, the black book right above the 11 mug. 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. Doesn't that book say, "Marxist Thought"? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. That is where it was found in his home, right? 16 A. Yes. 17 THE COURT: Can you please keep your voice up. 18 THE WITNESS: Yes. 19 BY MR. STERN: 20 Q. There were also books in his home on multiculturalism, 21 weren't there? 22 A. I don't recall. 23 MR. STERN: I am going to show you, with the court's 24 permission, 2301 M in evidence. 25 THE COURT: All right. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6433 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 BY MR. STERN: 2 Q. And ask you to look at a book to the left of the picture of 3 four women. Do you see the book I'm talking about? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. That book is entitled, "Multiculturalism," isn't it? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. Beneath that is a picture of a young man in what appears to 8 be an Army uniform, right? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Were you aware that was a picture of Mr. Yousry when he was 11 in the Egyptian Army? 12 A. No. 13 Q. Next is the picture of four women. Do you know what that 14 is? 15 A. No. 16 Q. It is fair to say, isn't it, there were books in his home 17 on Latin America, right? 18 A. I don't recall. 19 Q. Let's go back to 2301 L. If you can, try to -- do you see 20 a green book on the left on the shelf? 21 A. To the left of the shelf. 22 Q. I'll try to mark it -- that green book? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. Look about I think the top book on that shelf and see if 25 the title of that book is, "Economic crisis in Latin America"? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6434 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 A. I don't see it saying, "Economic crisis in Latin America." 2 Q. Pardon me? 3 A. I don't see it to state, "Economic crisis in Latin 4 America." 5 Q. What do you see it saying? 6 A. There is a book on that shelf that mentions Latin American 7 trade and economic restrictions in Latin America. 8 Q. Okay. There were also books on various religious figures 9 in Islam, weren't there? 10 A. Various religious figures? I don't recall. 11 MR. STERN: If I may, I would like to show you 2301 N, 12 which is in evidence. 13 THE COURT: All right. 14 BY MR. STERN: 15 Q. Look on the top of the file cabinet. Do you see a set of 16 books on the life of Jesus? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Next to that is a set of videotapes, eyes on prize, about 19 the civil rights movement, right? 20 A. I don't see where it says that. 21 Q. On the top of the shelf, the left there, is a photo of a 22 young woman, right? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. Did you know that was his daughter, Leslie? 25 A. I don't recall if I did. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6435 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 Q. Is it fair to say there were many, many different kinds of 2 books found in Mr. Yousry's home? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. And there were many, many movies, videos, right? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Many, many cassettes? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. And you weren't able while you were there to play all of 9 those and see what was on them, weren't you? 10 A. No, not in their entirety. 11 Q. So you had to either listen to small parts of them or take 12 them based on what was written on them, right? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. In the end, after the search had been done, you took out 15 over 20 boxes of materials, didn't you? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Among those materials were chapters from Mr. Yousry's 18 dissertation, weren't there? 19 A. I don't recall. 20 Q. Well, do you recall looking in the brown file cabinet which 21 you have been shown? 22 A. I'd have to see the photograph again. 23 MR. STERN: If I may show 2301 N. 24 THE COURT: Yes. 25 BY MR. STERN: SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6436 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 Q. Did you go looking in that file cabinet? 2 A. Not me personally doing the search of that file cabinet, 3 but I do recall agents reviewing that file cabinet, yes. 4 Q. Isn't it true that when you reviewed that file cabinet, 5 they found chapters and complete versions of Mr. Yousry's 6 dissertation on the Islamic Group and Sheikh Rahman? 7 A. I don't recall. 8 Q. We have talked at some length about the importance of 9 taking only those things which you're allowed to take by the 10 rider on the warrant, correct? 11 A. Yes. 12 MR. STERN: Judge, may I read an oral stipulation 13 between the government and the defense? 14 THE COURT: All right. 15 MR. STERN: The government and the defense stipulate 16 that the information prepared by Agent Kimberly Whittle 17 contains a general description by Agent Whittle of the items 18 seized during the search of defendant Yousry's residence. 19 BY MR. STERN: 20 Q. There are a number of items from that list prepared by 21 Agent Whittle, and I want you to tell me how those items fit 22 within the rider of the search warrant. Do you have a copy of 23 the search warrant there? 24 A. No. 25 Q. Would it be easier for me to provide you with a copy? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6437 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 A. Perhaps. 2 MR. STERN: May I approach for the moment? 3 THE COURT: Yes. 4 (Pause) 5 BY MR. STERN: 6 Q. That warrant allows you to take a number of different kinds 7 of things, right? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. It allows you to take books of various kinds, right? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. Audiotapes? 12 MR. MORVILLO: Excuse me, your Honor. Does it have a 13 defense exhibit number? 14 MR. STERN: MY -- 15 THE WITNESS: 28. 16 MR. STERN: -- MY 28. 17 BY MR. STERN: 18 Q. It allows you to take books, audiotapes, videotapes of 19 various kinds, right? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. Bills? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. Case files? 24 A. I don't see the term "case files," but -- 25 Q. Notebooks? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6438 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 A. Notebooks, yes. 2 Q. And all of the things -- that is not an a exhaustive list. 3 It allows you to take other things as well, correct? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. But all of the things on that list you're allowed to take 6 have to relate either to the Islamic Group, right? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Mr. Sattar? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Ms. Stewart? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. Other terrorist organizations? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. Are you allowed to take things from any other sources, that 15 is, relate to any other subjects? 16 A. Yes, if it is a subject that is in turn associated with Ms. 17 Stewart or Mr. Sattar or a terrorist organization. 18 Q. When you say that, what do you mean, a subject in any other 19 way associated with? 20 A. You mentioned the book on Latin America. If for some 21 reason that is deemed that that particular book had something 22 to do with Ms. Stewart, then we would take it. 23 So on its face, it might not seem that it pertains, 24 but if you had more detailed investigative knowledge of the 25 case, you could perhaps deem that is a pertinent item. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6439 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 Q. You mean, for example, written by her? 2 A. Excuse me? 3 Q. If it were written by her? 4 A. If it were written by her or in some other way associated. 5 I am giving an example, a favorite book of hers or a book that 6 she conversed about. 7 Q. So any book she conversed about you could take? 8 A. If it was -- no -- if it was something that was associated 9 with her, yes. 10 Q. Well, for instance, there was a phone conversation in which 11 she said I read my children Grimm's Fairy Tales last night, do 12 you think that would be appropriate to take? 13 A. If you knew the actual content of that conversation, if you 14 had that intimate knowledge that that is the way the 15 conversation was, and then going to a search and seeing that 16 book, I wouldn't deem that pertinent, no. 17 Q. It wouldn't fit within the rider, would it? 18 A. Again, it wouldn't fit if you had that intimate knowledge 19 of the conversation, I don't believe so. 20 Q. If it is not anything associated with Ms. Stewart or 21 Mr. Sattar or Mr. Yousry, you could say it had to have some 22 relevance to the case, didn't it? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. I am going to read you a list of items that the government 25 stipulates Agent Whittle described as being seized in this SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6440 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 case, and I want to ask you where you think those items fit 2 within that rider, okay? 3 Condolences on the death of Mr. Yousry's father? 4 A. I don't have intimate knowledge of the case to know where 5 it would fit within the rider. 6 Q. Didn't anyone tell you why that was being seized? 7 A. No. 8 Q. How about a book, "Understanding Cultural Diversity"? 9 A. I don't know where that would fall within this particular 10 rider. 11 Q. How about Memory and Modernity in Popular Culture in Latin 12 America? 13 A. That may or may not fit into the search rider. 14 Q. Which area would it fit in? 15 A. Any and all books and records and other documents, 16 including but not limited to the 1, 2, 3 -- the third item on 17 the rider. 18 Q. Go ahead. Does it add anything to that, any books and 19 documents -- 20 A. Any and all books and records and other documents, 21 including, but not limited to notes, letters, statements, 22 memoranda and other writings, related to, referring to or 23 regarding meetings, conversations, communications which Sheikh 24 Abdel Rahman, Abdel Rahman, Sattar, Stewart, IG or other known 25 IG members. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6441 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 Q. You think it is a possibility anything in popular culture 2 in Latin American fits into that rider? 3 A. May or may not. 4 Q. A letter from the International Fellowship of Christians 5 and Jews? 6 A. May or may not. 7 Q. Where do you think that would fit into the rider? 8 A. I believe there was one with regard to just general 9 documentation, any and all documents, books, literature, 10 writings or other media, including but not limited to 11 audiocassette tapes, discs, DVD and/or videotapes concerning or 12 relating to IG, Al-Quaeda, any other foreign terrorist 13 organization or entity thereof. 14 Q. You think Jews or Christians would fit within any other 15 terrorist organization or entity thereof? 16 MR. MORVILLO: Objection. 17 THE COURT: Sustained. 18 BY MR. STERN: 19 Q. How about a video of a baseball game, an old woman at a 20 birthday party and snow storm, which of the riders do you think 21 that fits in? 22 A. It may or may not fit into the rider with regard to the 23 videotapes and the audio cassettes. 24 Q. But it doesn't authorize just any video or audio cassettes, 25 does it? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6442 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 A. No. 2 Q. Only ones relating to a specific subject, right? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. What subject is that? 5 A. The individual Sheikh Abdel Rahman's, Mr. Sattar, Ms. 6 Stewart and IG or other known terrorist organizations. 7 Q. There were many things that since you yourself didn't 8 review them, you have no idea whether they should have been 9 seized pursuant to that warrant, do you? 10 A. Can you repeat that question. 11 Q. Yes. There were many things which you yourself did not 12 review? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. Most things, as a matter of fact, right? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. And so you have no idea whether or not many things seized 17 in this search fit within the rider we have just been talking 18 about, right? 19 A. I have an idea, yes. 20 Q. You have an idea? 21 A. Given the fact that the searching personnel I was dealing 22 with on that day acted responsibly, I know the members of the 23 search team and I know myself, and we tried as best we could to 24 adhere to the search warrant. 25 Q. You said -- SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6443 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 THE COURT: Whoa, whoa. 2 MR. STERN: I didn't mean to interrupt. 3 THE COURT: The reporter can only get one person 4 talking at the same time. 5 BY MR. STERN: 6 Q. I am sorry. Were you done? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. You are saying just that you relied on the good faith of 9 your fellow workers, right? 10 A. And the knowledge that the members of the case squad had 11 and the language specialist had of the case as well. 12 Q. So I just want to be sure I understand. 13 It is your position then, your belief that every 14 single thing seized in this case fits within that rider. Is 15 that right? 16 A. No. 17 Q. Is it your belief there were things seized in connection 18 with this case that don't fit within that rider? 19 A. There may have been items that ultimately were deemed not 20 pertinent to the investigation. 21 Q. Ultimately deemed by whom? 22 A. Ultimately deemed by the case agent or anyone that was a 23 part of that investigative team, the prosecution or 24 investigative. 25 Q. But they were seized nonetheless, right? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6444 49UJSAT3 Monaco - cross 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. And then later determined to not fit within anything in 3 that rider, correct? 4 A. Perhaps. 5 MR. STERN: I have nothing else. Thank you. 6 THE COURT: All right. Ladies and gentlemen, this is 7 an appropriate time to give you an instruction which I will 8 repeat at the conclusion, in my final instructions. 9 The items that were seized from Mr. Yousry's residence 10 and introduced into evidence were seized pursuant to a lawful 11 search, and you can consider those items along with all of the 12 other evidence in the case. 13 All right. 14 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, may I redirect? 15 THE COURT: Yes. 16 REDIRECT EXAMINATION 17 BY MR. MORVILLO: 18 Q. Agent Monaco, you testified on cross-examination that Case 19 Agent Kimberly Whittle was not at the briefing that you had 20 prior to the execution of the search warrant? 21 A. Yes, the briefing the day before the actual search. 22 Q. Do you know where she was? 23 A. No. 24 Q. Do you still have the rider in front of you? 25 A. Yes. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6445 49UJSAT3 Monaco - redirect 1 Q. I believe that is Defense Exhibit MY 28. Do you see the 2 first paragraph of the rider? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Does that limit the numbers, the items that can be seized 5 to any of those that are described in the rider? 6 A. Excuse me? 7 Q. Does the first paragraph limit or expand the list of items 8 that you can seize under the rider? Just read it to yourself. 9 A. It appears to expand. 10 Q. In what sense? 11 A. It appears to expand the rider in the sense that the 12 description is any and all evidence and indicia of the federal 13 violations stated in the paragraph. 14 Q. Including, but not limited to, the specific items 15 designated in the rider. Is that correct? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Mr. Stern asked you about several items that were seized, 18 condolence card, a book on multiculturalism. 19 Do you know, as you sit there, where those items were 20 seized from? 21 A. No. 22 Q. Do you know who seized those items? 23 A. No. 24 Q. Would it be possible that items that were seized were found 25 in large boxes of documents, where you seized the entirety of SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6446 49UJSAT3 Monaco - redirect 1 the box? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Did you knowingly seize any documents that you believed did 4 not fall within -- 5 A. No. 6 Q. Do you know whether other members of the search team seized 7 documents that it did not believe fell within -- 8 MR. STERN: Objection. 9 THE COURT: Sustained. 10 BY MR. MORVILLO: 11 Q. -- to your knowledge? 12 MR. STERN: Objection. 13 THE COURT: Sustained. 14 MR. MORVILLO: May I have a moment, your Honor? 15 THE COURT: Sure. 16 (Pause) 17 BY MR. MORVILLO: 18 Q. Agent Monaco, the items that Mr. Stern listed, you don't 19 know who the seizing agent was for that, is that correct? 20 You testified to that? 21 A. I don't who the actual agent collector was for those items. 22 Q. Do you know who made the decision to seize any of those 23 items? 24 A. No. 25 MR. MORVILLO: Nothing further. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6447 49UJSAT3 Monaco - redirect 1 THE COURT: All right. 2 RECROSS EXAMINATION 3 BY MR. STERN: 4 Q. Agent, you were just asked about -- 5 THE COURT: Mr. Stern, you may examine, limited to 6 redirect. 7 BY MR. STERN: 8 Q. -- you were just asked about the lead-in paragraph to the 9 rider, whether or not it expands or contracts what you're 10 allowed to seize, correct? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. That rider, that is, that paragraph of the rider, limits it 13 to evidence and indicia of violations of 18 U.S.C. 2339 (b), 14 material support of a foreign terrorist organization, right? 15 A. You used the term -- repeat the question, please. 16 Q. Just look at the top paragraph of the rider which Mr. 17 Morvillo asked you about, correct? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. That doesn't say take whatever you want and special list 20 the things, does it? 21 A. No. 22 Q. It limits it to evidence and indicia of violations of 23 certain crimes, correct? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. It limits it to violations of the crime of material support SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6448 49UJSAT3 Monaco - recross 1 of a foreign terrorist organization, correct? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. And it limits it to conspiracy to defraud the United 4 States, right? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. It is not just a carte blanche to go to a home and seize 7 whatever you want and then later figure out what is good for 8 you, is it? 9 A. No. 10 Q. You were asked about seizing one item in a box, correct? 11 A. I don't recall. 12 Q. Didn't Mr. Morvillo ask you some of these were in big 13 boxes? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. Your obligation in a search is to examine each document and 16 each item, isn't it? 17 A. It is to review the documents as much as possible, yes. 18 Q. So the fact you found, for example, one page relating to IG 19 in a box of Superman comic books wouldn't mean you seize the 20 whole box, would it? 21 A. No. If it was deemed that those comic books had nothing to 22 do with the investigation, no. 23 Q. So you seize the whole box, that meant you made a 24 determination everything in that box had something to do with 25 the investigation, right? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6449 49UJSAT3 Monaco - recross 1 A. That upon review of all the documentation in that box, it 2 it appeared that a substantial, overwhelming portion of the 3 documentation in that box were in response to the search 4 warrant. 5 Q. By reviewing on the scene, right? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. Because if it didn't, you wouldn't be allowed to take it, 8 right? 9 A. If, upon reviewing it, we saw that a substantial number of 10 documents were not responsive to the search warrant, then, no, 11 we would not take the entire box. 12 Q. You would just take out the ones that were, right? 13 A. Yes. 14 MR. STERN: Thank you. 15 MR. MORVILLO: Nothing further your Honor. 16 THE COURT: All right. The witness is excused. You 17 may step down. 18 (Witness excused) 19 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, at this point, the government 20 calls Walid Farhoud. 21 THE COURT: All right. 22 WALID FARHOUD, 23 called as a witness by the Government, 24 having been duly sworn, testified as follows: 25 DIRECT EXAMINATION SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6450 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 MR. BARKOW: May Mr. Dember approach the witness and 2 give him some water before we start? 3 THE COURT: Yes. 4 BY MR. BARKOW: 5 Q. Good afternoon, Mr. Farhoud. 6 A. Good afternoon. 7 Q. What do you do for a living? 8 A. I am a professional interpreter and translator. 9 Q. You are both a translator and interpreter? 10 A. Yes, I am. 11 Q. What do you mean when you say translator? What does that 12 mean? What do you do? 13 A. I am a translator of text either in English or Arabic, and 14 you translate it to -- 15 Q. What about "interpret," what do you mean when you use the 16 word "interpret"? 17 A. An interpreter hears a conversation, and you translate 18 verbatim what is being said to the other language. 19 Q. Now I want to ask you some questions about your education 20 and your work history. 21 Where do you work, the name of the company you work at 22 right now? 23 A. I have my own small company called Middle East 24 International in Seattle, Washington. 25 Q. Do you own that company? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6451 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 A. Yes, I do. 2 Q. Are you responsible for running that company? 3 A. Yes, I am. 4 Q. Do you have employees or do you contract with people to 5 work for you? 6 A. I have a small company. Sometimes when I have a big 7 project, I hire other people to help me out. 8 Q. How long have you been running this company? 9 A. Since 1980. 10 Q. Have you been working for the company as an interpreter and 11 translator during that period of time? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. About how many times in your career have you worked as an 14 interpreter? 15 A. Thousands of times. 16 Q. In what courts? 17 A. Superior court, immigration judge court and federal court. 18 Q. When you say Superior court, that is a state court? 19 A. Yes, it is. 20 Q. What state? 21 A. In the State of Washington. 22 Q. When you say "immigration court," is that a federal 23 immigration court? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Where is that? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6452 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 A. In Seattle, Washington. 2 Q. When you say "federal court," what federal courts have 3 undone work for? 4 A. Mainly in Seattle. I did one in Idaho, too. 5 Q. Do you work primarily or have you worked primarily for 6 defendants or for the government? 7 A. 99 percent of my time, if not more, I work for the 8 defendant. 9 Q. How many cases do you think you've worked on where you 10 worked for a defendant or defendants? 11 A. For the defendant? 12 Q. For a defendant or defendants? 13 A. Thousands of times. 14 Q. How many different people, that is, how many different 15 defendants have you worked for? 16 A. Thousands of people. 17 Q. How many times have you worked for the government? 18 A. In the capacity of translating and interpreting? 19 Q. Yes. 20 A. Three cases, maybe. 21 Q. Now, I wanted to ask you some questions about your 22 educational background. 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. Where did you grow up? Where were you born? 25 A. I was born in a northern area, small town called Rama, by SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6453 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 Nazareth. 2 Q. Is Rama R A M A? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. How do you spell Nazareth? 5 A. N A Z A R E T H. 6 Q. Where is that in the world? 7 A. I describe it as the northern part of Palestine, or you can 8 call it the northern part of Israel. 9 Q. Where did you go to high school? 10 A. I went to high school to that town. 11 Q. You graduated from that? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. Did you receive receive a degree? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. What kind of degree? 16 A. A Bagruth would qualify you to higher education, 17 universities. 18 Q. What languages or what language or languages were your 19 courses taught in in that high school? 20 A. Arabic, Hebrew and English. 21 Q. After you received your degree, did you go onto higher 22 education? 23 A. Yes, I did. 24 Q. Where did you go? 25 A. I went into a combined degree between the Hebrew University SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6454 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 in Jerusalem and the American University in Jerusalem. 2 Q. Did you receive a degree from those institutions? 3 A. Yes, I have a B A in Middle Eastern studies. 4 Q. When did you get that? 5 A. It was in 1973. 6 Q. In what language or languages were your courses taught in 7 in university? 8 A. In three languages I mentioned; Arabic, Hebrew and English. 9 Q. At the same time you were going to university, were you 10 studying other things at the same time? 11 A. During my studies in Jerusalem, I was very much interested 12 in journalism, so I attended a special academy for journalists 13 and news writing, and I graduated from that school, too. 14 Q. In what language or languages were you doing your 15 journalistic reporting and writing? 16 A. I was doing the reporting in Arabic and Hebrew, but the 17 studies were done in the three languages. Sometimes I have to 18 translate from English to Arabic or Hebrew. 19 Q. At the same time, were you teaching Arabic to anyone? 20 A. Yes, at that period of time I was going to school, I was 21 teaching at the municipal centers in Jerusalem, I was teaching 22 Arabic. 23 Q. After you received these degrees in journalistic reporting 24 and university degrees, did you go on for further education? 25 A. Yes, I continued my masters degree at the University of SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6455 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 Washington. 2 Q. That is the University of Washington, in the United States? 3 A. Yes, in Seattle, Washington. 4 Q. You moved to the United States at that point? 5 A. Sorry? 6 Q. You moved to the United States at that point? 7 A. Yes, I moved to the United States in 1974. 8 Q. Tell us about the education you received, graduate and 9 postgraduate education you received. 10 A. The courses were totally in Arabic and Hebrew and English 11 because they related to the Middle Eastern studies. I studied 12 the politics and history of the Middle East, some Islamic 13 courses. 14 Q. Did you receive a degree? 15 A. I finished all the required amount for the MA, and I passed 16 the thesis and the exams, but if I went to the graduation, then 17 I will hold myself in a title position to apply for a graduate 18 degree, for a Ph.D program, so at that time I kept it handy and 19 continued with post-graduate studies. 20 Q. Post-graduate studies, that would be in furtherance of 21 getting a Ph.D? 22 A. Yes, that is a 600, 700 and 800 courses. 23 Q. Now, at the same time that you were taking this graduate 24 and postgraduate education, were you teaching at all? 25 A. Yes, I was teaching both Arabic and Hebrew at the SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6456 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 University of Washington. 2 Q. How many years did you go to the University of Washington? 3 A. Four years, almost five. 4 Q. You mentioned that you had been working at your company, 5 Middle East International since about 1980. 6 At the same time, and aside from that, did you have 7 other jobs that involved Arabic or English or translation? 8 A. I did interpretation, translation to companies and things 9 like that. 10 Q. Did you ever work in radio? 11 A. Yes, yes. I produced the programs for the Arabic radio 12 broadcast in Seattle, Washington, and at the same time I 13 reported to a newspaper called AL W A K I H. 14 Q. These courses for the radio, work for the radio, what kind 15 of work was that? 16 A. I basically produced a particular program, doing a 17 voiceover for a particular program and subject to Arabic 18 broadcasting. 19 Q. That involved translation or interpretation? 20 A. Yes, it did. 21 Q. You mentioned you were born in Palestine. How long had you 22 lived there? 23 A. I lived there till I left, in 1974. 24 Q. How old were you when you left? 25 A. I was 24 years' old. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6457 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 Q. What language or languages did you speak growing up? 2 A. I spoke Arabic and Hebrew and English. 3 Q. Are you fluent in Arabic? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Are you fluent in English? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. What do you consider your native language or languages? 8 A. Native? I classify them as Native A, Native B. Native A 9 is Arabic and Hebrew, Native B is English. 10 MR. BARKOW: At this point, the government asks 11 Mr. Farhoud be permitted to testify as an expert in the area of 12 Arabic to English translation. 13 THE COURT: All right, I'll allow the witness to 14 testify. 15 BY MR. BARKOW: 16 Q. Now, Mr. Farhoud, have you done translation work for this 17 case? 18 A. Yes, I did. 19 Q. Did you work on the translation of a book? 20 A. Yes, I did. 21 Q. I want to ask you about that. 22 A. Yes. 23 MR. BARKOW: May I approach, your Honor? 24 THE COURT: Yes. 25 BY MR. BARKOW: SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6458 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 Q. Mr. Farhoud, I am putting before you what I have marked for 2 identification and shown to counsel Government Exhibit 22O2 A, 3 which is in evidence; 2202 B, which is in evidence; and 2202 -- 4 let me make sure I said that correctly -- 2202 A, which is in 5 evidence; 2202 B, which is in evidence; and 2202 T, which I 6 have marked for identification, okay? 7 Mr. Farhoud, do you see those exhibits I put before 8 you? 9 A. Yes, I do. 10 Q. Looking first at 2202 A and 2202 B, do you recognize those? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. What are those? 13 A. This is a book in Arabic by an author called Rafa'i -- 14 Q. Would you please spell that name. 15 A. R I F A I, A H M A D, T A H A. 16 Q. Would you spell the middle name again? 17 A. A H M A D. 18 Q. You say that they are, the two exhibits I exhibit you 19 about, 2202 A and B, are a book. What do you mean by the two 20 documents are a book? 21 A. This is a whole book. This is the first part of the book, 22 and this is the second part of the book. 23 Q. Which one is the first part and which is the second? 24 A. 2202 A is the first part of the book and 2202 B is the 25 second part of the book. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6459 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 Q. Now, taking a look at Government Exhibit 22O2 T, do you 2 recognize that? 3 A. Yes, I do. 4 Q. What is that? 5 A. This is the translation of the whole 2202 A and 2202 B, and 6 the translation in it is only for Chapter 1 and Chapter 5, and 7 reviews of Chapter 2 to Chapter 4. 8 Q. When you say it is a translation of 1 and 5, what kind of 9 translation? 10 A. That is a verbatim translation. 11 Q. Word-for-word? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. The other chapters, 2 through 4, what kind of translation 14 is that? 15 A. They are reviews, basically it is I will read the chapter 16 and I will put what I read in that chapter, but not verbatim. 17 Q. You prepared this translation? 18 A. Yes, I did. 19 Q. Is it a true and accurate translation from Arabic into 20 English, to the best of your ability? 21 A. Yes. 22 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, may I approach? 23 THE COURT: Yes. 24 (Pause) 25 BY MR. BARKOW: SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6460 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 Q. Mr. Farhoud, now I am showing you what is in evidence as 2 Government Exhibit 2202 C. Would you take a look at that. 3 Do you recognize 2202 C? 4 A. Yes, it is an identical copy of 2202 B. 5 Q. You have compared 2202 B to 2202 C? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. They're the same? 8 A. Yes. 9 THE COURT: You referred to 2202 C, 2202 C in 10 evidence? 11 MR. BARKOW: Yes, your Honor. May I approach? 12 THE COURT: Yes. 13 (Pause) 14 BY MR. BARKOW: 15 Q. Now, Mr. Farhoud, I am going to put before you what is 16 marked for identification as Government Exhibit 2700 and 2700 17 T. I am asking you first to take a look at Government Exhibit 18 2700, which is marked for identification, not in evidence. 19 Do you recognize that? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. What is it? 22 A. This is a newer edition for the same book. 23 Q. And taking a look at Exhibit 2700 T marked for 24 identification, do you recognize Exhibit 2700 T? 25 A. Yes, it is a verbatim translation that I have done for SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6461 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 Chapter 1 and Chapter 5. 2 Q. Of what? 3 A. Of that 2700. 4 Q. Is Government Exhibit 2700 T a true and accurate 5 translation from Arabic into English of Government Exhibit 6 2700? 7 A. To the best of my knowledge, yes. 8 MR. BARKOW: At this point, the government offers 9 Government Exhibit 22O2 T, 2700 and 2700 T. 10 THE COURT: All right. 2202 T, 2700 and 2700 T 11 received in evidence. 12 (Government Exhibits 2202 T, 2700 and 2700 T received 13 in evidence) 14 THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, these exhibits are 15 received solely with respect to Counts 2 and 3 of the 16 indictment. They cannot be considered for the truth of any of 17 the matters asserted against Ms. Stewart or Mr. Yousry, and 18 they are admitted subject to connection against Mr. Sattar for 19 the truth of any of the matters asserted in the book. 20 MR. BARKOW: May I continue, your Honor? 21 THE COURT: Yes. 22 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, may I put on the Elmo for the 23 jurors and Mr. Farhoud Government Exhibit 2700 in evidence? 24 THE COURT: Yes. 25 (Pause) SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6462 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 MR. BARKOW: May I approach and hold it up for him. 2 It is too big to put on the Elmo? 3 THE COURT: All right. 4 BY MR. BARKOW: 5 Q. Mr. Farhoud, now I am putting in front of you, on the 6 screen in front of you, Government Exhibit 2700. Do you see 7 this text right here? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. Is that the title of the book? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. What is the title of the book? 12 A. In Arabic, "The unveiling of the rulings about the higher 13 principles of Islam." 14 Q. Would you take a stab at spelling the Arabic title you 15 spelled for the court reporter, just in transliterated 16 spelling. 17 A. E M A A, T A D A L L I T H A A M, I A N, B A D A H K A A M, 18 T H E R W A T, S A N A A M, A L -- I S A A M. 19 Q. Do you see that I am pointing at the bottom to this line 20 here? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. What does that say? 23 A. (Arabic) 24 Q. What does that mean in English? 25 A. Islamic observations and interpretations. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6463 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 Q. What about this at the top, what does that mean in English? 2 A. (Arabic) 3 Q. Opening this exhibit to not the first, but what is the 4 first inside page and the next page? Do you see what I am 5 placing before you? Can you read what I am pointing at here 6 where it has this number? 7 A. I S B number 0-903730-01-15. 8 Q. That first digit is actually a 1, not an I. 9 A. Correct. 10 Q. And can you see, does it say when this was published? 11 A. It says January 1421, January, which is January 2001. 12 Q. Does it list an identifiable publisher at the bottom? 13 A. Yes, it is the Islamic Observation Center. 14 Q. They're located, according to this, in London? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Now, Mr. Farhoud, about how long did it take for you to do 17 this translation work that you just testified about; that is, 18 to translate the older version and the more recent version? 19 A. The work involved to translate the old one, then the new 20 one, then review the chapter in-between for the first book, 21 then make a comparison between the first and the second. 22 Q. How long did it take you to do it? 23 A. Approximately four and a half months. 24 Q. About how many days a week did you work on it? 25 A. Six days a week, about five hours a day. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6464 49UJSAT3 Farhoud - direct 1 Q. In order to do this translation, how many times, 2 approximately, did you have to read this book? 3 A. At least 10 times. 4 Q. Incidentally, are you an employee of the government, 5 federal, state or -- 6 A. No, I am not. 7 Q. Are you paid for your work in this case? 8 A. Yes. I am a contractor. I am contracted for the job. 9 Q. Paid by the government? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. You mentioned that Government Exhibit 2700, you said it was 12 a more recent edition of the book as compared to 2202 A and B? 13 How do you know that? 14 A. If you pay attention to the face type, it is totally 15 different. The modern one -- should I refer to them as A or B 16 or Exhibit 2700? 17 Q. You would agree you referred to the more recent one as 18 2700? 19 A. Yes. 20 (Continued on next page) 21 22 23 24 25 SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6465 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 Q. And the 2202A and B as then the older one? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Why don't you use more recent than older? 4 A. The more recent one, the typeset in it, it is a modern 5 typeset. It is electronic. You can tell it is perhaps made by 6 Word document. The older version, you look at the fonts and it 7 looks like it is done in an old printing house. The newer 8 version, it is organized as such that it tells who the older is 9 when they publish it, who is publishing it, giving it the ISV 10 number, the international coding number. It has the rights 11 reserve. It has dedication and it has an epilogue and it is 12 numbered, the pages are numbered. The older one doesn't have 13 that. 14 Q. And does the newer one have a -- more recent one have a 15 table of contents? 16 A. Yes, it does have table of content. The other one doesn't 17 have. 18 Q. And Mr. Farhoud, I want to ask you about your work on 19 Government Exhibit 2700T. Did you use a shading system in that 20 translation to explain your work? 21 A. Yes, I did. 22 Q. Could you please explain for the jury what the shading 23 system is that you used? By shading system, what did you shade 24 or not shade, text? 25 A. Basically, this was a way to make a comparison between the SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6466 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 older version and the newer version. So when I have a text in 2 the black with the white font, that means it is in the old 3 edition, but it is not in the newer edition. And then in the 4 darker gray with the white font, the text is in the new 5 edition, but not in the older edition. And in the lighter gray 6 with the black font, it is in both edition. It is either the 7 text are put in two different places or he formatted the 8 sentences in different structure. 9 Q. And is there some text that's not shaded at all? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. What does that mean? 12 A. That is what is in the old and what's in the new are the 13 same. Nothing changed. 14 Q. Now, in your translation work between the older edition and 15 the newer edition, could you estimate about how much of it 16 overlaps completely, that is, is not shaded at all in your 17 translation 2700T? 18 A. I think it is over 95 percent the same. 19 Q. Now, I am going to ask you a few other questions about the 20 notations you used in 2700T, the newer edition, more recent 21 edition. There are some things that are in brackets. What 22 does that mean? 23 A. The things in the brackets, it is something I used for 24 myself to give my opinion about something in the statement or 25 the statement in English doesn't make much sense without adding SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6467 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 that particular word, so I have to add that particular word to 2 complete the statement. Or if there is a word that have 3 synonyms. If there is a word that has a different -- they mean 4 the same thing, but they are different word for it. 5 Q. So the information that's contained in the brackets, you 6 added that information? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Is that information true and accurate to the best of your 9 ability as a translator? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. Now, there is also information that's in parentheticals, 12 parenthesis instead of brackets. What does that mean? 13 A. They are the same text in the Arabic text, just were 14 carried over to the translation. 15 Q. That is the book itself that you translated had the 16 information in parenthesis and you just left them there? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. What about when there is things in italics in your 19 translation? 20 A. There is a Quranic verses that were in the Arabic text 21 written in italic to separate the Quranic text from the text of 22 the book. 23 Q. Finally, you used bold face text sometimes. What does that 24 mean? 25 A. Bold face. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6468 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 Q. There is text in the translation, 2700, that's in bold. 2 A. This is -- the writer in his Arabic text have those in 3 bold, so I carried them to the translation version in the same 4 manner. 5 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, I'm hearing some feedback. I 6 don't know if other people are hearing that. It may be the 7 court reporter's device or something, but I'm hearing feedback. 8 I don't know if other people hear like a high-pitched noise 9 every time somebody speaks. 10 THE COURT: My deputy, who is an expert on sound 11 systems, believes it is coming from one of the microphones or 12 someone speaking into the microphone. Let's continue for a 13 moment and see if it continues. I can hear it some. 14 Why don't we take -- it is not ready for lunch, but 15 let's take at least a five-minute break just to check out the 16 microphones. 17 Ladies and gentlemen, please remember when you're in 18 the jury box not to talk to each other. And if anyone needs a 19 break, just raise your hand. Thanks. 20 Remember not to talk about the case. Always keep an 21 open mind. Please follow Mr. Fletcher into the jury room. 22 (Jury not present) 23 MR. BARKOW: It was hurting my ears. 24 THE COURT: It is all right. Several of the jurors 25 were giving us feedback of one sort or another, either shaking SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6469 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 their head that they heard something or didn't hear something, 2 and it was convenient to take a break so you can work out any 3 problems with the microphone. 4 And I also -- I told the jurors because I thought I 5 saw one juror talk to each other and I don't want that, so I 6 told them that. And you can take five minutes or 10 minutes to 7 cure the problem. And if it goes to the lunchtime, we will go 8 through the lunchtime. 9 (Recess) 10 THE COURT: It is 12:45. The lunches have arrived and 11 so I'm prepared to break for lunch. Mr. Fletcher tells me that 12 there is no problem that was found with the sound system. 13 MR. BARKOW: Someone came, your Honor, and looked at 14 it and basically the two remedies that we tried were, one, was 15 unplugging the microphone on the podium right in front of the 16 jury box because we thought that might be the source of the 17 feedback, and the other is that the court reporter's device, we 18 were going to try to have it off and see if that clears the 19 problem. 20 THE COURT: Well, you can work on those. I don't see 21 any reason to bring the jury back and to tell them we will 22 break for lunch until 2:00. 23 MR. TIGAR: From the standpoint of the Stewart team I 24 don't see it either. I see here you gave the instruction when 25 you left. We are satisfied with that. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6470 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 THE COURT: I will just have Mr. Fletcher tell the 2 jury that they can have lunch and we will resume at 2:00, if 3 that's satisfactory to everyone. 4 MR. BARKOW: Yes, your Honor. 5 MR. DEMBER: Your Honor, may I raise one issue? 6 THE COURT: The witness may step down. 7 MR. DEMBER: It is a small matter, your Honor. Either 8 late today or on Monday we intend to offer a witness and play a 9 video, very short videotape that is an excerpt from some 10 videotape that we provided to defense counsel in the past. All 11 that's shown on the videotape essentially is Abdel Rahman 12 himself, Mr. Sattar and others coming out of a doorway, and it 13 occurred on the day that INS officials took Mr. Abdel Rahman 14 into custody back in 1993. As I said, it is a very brief 15 video. It is apparently shot by some TV news crew of some kind 16 on the day that he surrendered back in '93. 17 The purpose of introducing this is simply to show the 18 relationship between Mr. Sattar and Abdel Rahman. There is no 19 speaking on the videotape. There is no sound. And the agent 20 will simply testify that he was present when Abdel Rahman was 21 taken into custody. He is an INS agent and that's really the 22 essence and that this tape is taken that day. Simple as that. 23 Mr. Paul indicated he will object to this. So before, 24 obviously, we put an agent on the stand and try to introduce 25 this, this needs to be resolved. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6471 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 MR. PAUL: Your Honor, just briefly, I do object to 2 it. I don't see the relevance. All these issues have in fact 3 been established. There is no issue of the fact that the 4 Sheikh was arrested. There is no issue to my client's 5 relationship to the Sheikh. I have seen the excerpt a long 6 time ago. And my recollection of the excerpt is in fact it is 7 not just simply the Sheikh being ushered out from the mosque to 8 the street. There is a great deal of commotion going on on the 9 street, people shouting and screaming. I would object to it. 10 MR. DEMBER: Your Honor, there is no actual footage of 11 anything happening on the street. 12 I should add, by the way, that there is nothing in the 13 footage which shows the agents taking, actually taking Abdel 14 Rahman into custody. It is him coming out of the doorway with 15 people surrounding him. 16 THE COURT: I can't decide that without Mr. Paul 17 looking at the videotape and knowing what's on the videotape 18 that the government is offering. And if there continues to be 19 an objection, I'll review it myself. I can't do that now. 20 MR. DEMBER: Your Honor, we will do it during the 21 lunch break before we start up at 2:00. I don't think our 22 equipment is set up for that. If not, we can do it very 23 quickly during the afternoon break, if your Honor wishes. And 24 if we can't make a decision at that point and we can't get it 25 done at that time, we will do it on Monday if it is admitted SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6472 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 into evidence. 2 THE COURT: See you at 2:00. 3 (Luncheon recess) 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6473 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 AFTERNOON SESSION 2 2:15 p.m. 3 (In open court; jury not present) 4 THE COURT: Bring in the jury. We will continue with 5 the testimony of the witness. 6 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, while we are waiting, unless 7 the Court directs a written response to Ms. Stewart's latest 8 motion, I am prepared to simply respond to it orally at 10:00 9 tomorrow. 10 THE COURT: All right. 11 (Jury present) 12 THE COURT: Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. 13 Good to see you. 14 The witness is on the stand. 15 Mr. Fletcher. 16 THE DEPUTY CLERK: The witness is reminded he is still 17 under oath. 18 BY MR. BARKOW: 19 Q. Mr. Farhoud, what I am going to ask you to do now is read 20 to the jury some portions of Government Exhibit 2700T, which is 21 in evidence. 22 MR. BARKOW: May I approach, your Honor? 23 THE COURT: Yes. 24 Q. Mr. Farhoud, I have placed before you what I have marked 25 for identification as Government Exhibit 2700TH. Do you see SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6474 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 that? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Does Government Exhibit 2700TH, is that identical to 4 Government Exhibit 2700T? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Does it also have highlighted certain portions? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. And is that highlighting, does that indicate the portions 9 that you expect to read here today? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. Would it assist you in your testimony to use Government 12 Exhibit 2700TH in order to read that to the jury? 13 A. Yes. 14 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, at this point the government 15 offers Government Exhibit 2700TH as a demonstrative aide to 16 Mr. Farhoud's testimony. 17 THE COURT: All right. Government Exhibit 2700TH 18 received as a demonstrative aide to the witness's testimony. 19 (Government's Exhibit 2700TH received in evidence) 20 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, may I begin to publish that 21 exhibit on the Elmo and ask Mr. Farhoud to read the indicated 22 portions? 23 THE COURT: Yes. 24 Q. Mr. Farhoud, I am going to direct your attention first -- 25 I'm putting on page 3. I am going to ask you to read the SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6475 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 highlighted portions to the jury. 2 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 3 witness) 4 Q. Turning to page 6 -- 5 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 6 witness) 7 Q. Mr. Farhoud, I am going to do this occasionally. This text 8 here is gray with white font. That means that it is in the new 9 edition but not the old edition, is that right? 10 A. That's right. 11 Q. Now I am going to show you page 7 and ask you to read the 12 highlighted portion. 13 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 14 witness) 15 Q. Again, this is gray with white, so this is in the new 16 edition, but not the old edition? 17 A. That's right. 18 Q. Page 9, Mr. Farhoud. 19 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 20 witness) 21 Q. And page 10. 22 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 23 witness) 24 Q. Again, Mr. Farhoud, the passage you just read is in gray 25 with white typing, correct? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6476 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. Meaning it is in the new book and not the old one? 3 A. That's right. 4 Q. Page 12, please. 5 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 6 witness) 7 Q. I am not going to do this all the way through, Mr. Farhoud. 8 Just to be clear, this part that I'm pointing to here in gray, 9 that means it is in the new version and not the older draft? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. The part above, there is no highlighting in both. Does 12 that mean it is identical in both? 13 A. Identical in both. 14 Q. Bottom of page 12. 15 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 16 witness) 17 Q. Page 13. 18 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 19 witness) 20 Q. Page 14. 21 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 22 witness) 23 Q. Page 16. 24 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 25 witness) SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6477 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 Q. Mr. Farhoud, this is the first topic of the book, and it 2 says verbatim. What does that mean? 3 A. That's from this point on the translation is verbatim 4 translation of the Arabic text. 5 Q. The stuff that you just read, is that verbatim as well? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. Page 18. 8 MR. BARKOW: I'm sorry, your Honor? 9 THE COURT: It is all right. Go ahead. 10 Q. Page 18. 11 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 12 witness) 13 Q. Page 19. 14 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 15 witness) 16 Q. Page 21. 17 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 18 witness) 19 Q. And 22. 20 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 21 witness) 22 THE COURT: Let's take a moment for a stretch break. 23 Proceed. 24 Q. Mr. Farhoud, page 34. 25 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6478 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 witness) 2 Q. And here, again, there is no highlighting and so that means 3 what? 4 A. It is identical in both books. 5 Q. Page 41. 6 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 7 witness) 8 Q. Page 44. 9 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 10 witness) 11 Q. Page 50. 12 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 13 witness) 14 Q. 52. 15 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 16 witness) 17 Q. 53. 18 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 19 witness) 20 Q. 55. 21 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 22 witness) 23 Q. 56. 24 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 25 witness) SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6479 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 Q. Next page, 57. 2 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 3 witness) 4 Q. 62. 5 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 6 witness) 7 Q. 70. 8 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 9 witness) 10 Q. And 71. 11 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 12 witness) 13 Q. Page 73. 14 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 15 witness) 16 Q. Mr. Farhoud, you had said previously that the book is 17 divided into five topics? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. Is this what you were referring to, the fifth topic? 20 That's the fifth of those five? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Page 82. 23 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 24 witness) 25 Q. 85. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6480 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 2 witness) 3 Q. And Mr. Farhoud, up until this page, what topic had you 4 been reading from? 5 A. Topic No. 1, first topic. 6 Q. 89. 7 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 8 witness) 9 Q. 113. 10 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 11 witness) 12 THE COURT: What page are you at? 13 MR. BARKOW: 113. 14 THE COURT: 113? 15 MR. BARKOW: Yes, your Honor. 16 THE COURT: All right. 17 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 18 witness) 19 Q. 114. 20 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 21 witness) 22 Q. Next page, 116. 23 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 24 witness) 25 Q. 132. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6481 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 2 witness) 3 THE COURT: Hold on just a moment. Let's take a 4 stretch break. 5 Okay. 6 Q. Mr. Farhoud, you just read this page, page 132. I just 7 want to ask you a question about it. 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. Right here you have other than and then in brackets 10 unmarried people. Can you explain what you mean by your 11 brackets there? 12 THE COURT: Mr. Barkow, could you keep your voice up 13 and use the microphone. 14 MR. BARKOW: I'm sorry. Yes. 15 Q. You have here in your brackets unmarried people, other than 16 unmarried people. Can you explain what your bracketed phrase 17 means? 18 A. That is my interpretation of the word that he mentioned. 19 Q. And so this sentence, hotels that rent joint rooms in such 20 a manner that other than, can you explain what you meant by 21 putting that bracket into that sentence? 22 A. In the text says they can rent to noncouple. This is 23 unmarried people, so I have to put it there in between the 24 parenthesis as my interpretation of the word. 25 Q. Page 135. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6482 49UMSAT4 Farhoud - direct 1 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 2 witness) 3 Q. Mr. Farhoud, this is black with white type. What does that 4 mean? 5 A. It means it is in the old edition but is not in the new. 6 Q. Page 150. 7 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 8 witness) 9 Q. Next page, 151. 10 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 11 witness) 12 Q. The next page, 152. 13 (Yellow-highlighted portion of page read by the 14 witness) 15 MR. BARKOW: May I have just a moment, your Honor? 16 THE COURT: Yes. 17 MR. BARKOW: I have nothing further, your Honor. 18 THE COURT: No further questions. The witness is 19 excused. You may step down. 20 (Witness excused) 21 MR. RUHNKE: Your Honor, we had a request that we were 22 going to make to the Court. I don't know if you were going to 23 take a break now or in a little while. It was about a limiting 24 instruction that you gave earlier -- 25 THE COURT: I'm sorry? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6483 49UMSAT4 1 MR. RUHNKE: About repeating a limiting instruction, 2 given the nature of this -- 3 THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, when I admitted the 4 exhibit I gave you a limiting instruction and I will repeat 5 that limiting instruction for you now. 6 This exhibit is admitted solely with respect to Counts 7 2 and 3 of the indictment. It cannot be considered for the 8 truth of any of the matters asserted against Ms. Stewart or 9 Mr. Yousry. And it is admitted subject to connection against 10 Mr. Sattar for the truth of any of the matters asserted in the 11 book. 12 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, may we have a minute to check 13 and see if the next witness is here? 14 THE COURT: Well, it is 3:00. We can take a 10-minute 15 break and then resume. 16 Ladies and gentlemen, please, please remember my 17 continuing instructions. Don't talk about this case at all. 18 Always remember to keep an open mind until you have heard all 19 of the evidence, I have instructed you on the law and you have 20 gone to the jury room to begin your deliberations. See you 21 after the short break. 22 All rise, please, and please follow Mr. Fletcher to 23 the jury room. 24 (Jury not present) 25 MR. DEMBER: Your Honor, this will be very brief. We SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6484 49UMSAT4 1 showed -- Mr. Paul looked at the videotape. 2 THE COURT: Please have a seat. 3 MR. DEMBER: He still objects to it. We have it cued 4 up. It is literally only 17 seconds. If the Court wishes to 5 look at it now, we can play it for the Court. Can we do that? 6 THE COURT: Sure. 7 (Videotape played) 8 MR. PAUL: Your Honor, my objection stands. 9 First of all, although there is no sound, there is 10 certainly gesticulating on the part of my client. I don't know 11 the relevance to this. There is even a frame where he is 12 sitting next to the Sheikh, and I believe that's already been 13 introduced previously, that very same picture, earlier in this 14 trial. I would object. My objection stands. 15 THE COURT: Has it? Has the picture of Mr. Sattar and 16 the Sheikh -- 17 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, I think the answer to that is 18 yes, but I don't know for sure. 19 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, that was a photograph taken 20 from a magazine article that was read during the May 20 prison 21 visit by Mr. Yousry to Sheikh Abdel Rahman. 22 MR. BARKOW: I think it was in the Sattar search 23 material. 24 MR. MORVILLO: It is also in the Yousry search 25 material. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6485 49UMSAT4 1 THE COURT: Is it in evidence? 2 MR. BARKOW: I think so, your Honor. We are checking 3 to make sure. I think Mr. Paul is correct. 4 THE COURT: I would allow the freeze frame for the 5 photo to show the relationship between the Sheikh and 6 Mr. Sattar, but not the videotape. 7 See you shortly. 8 (Recess) 9 (Continued on next page) 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6486 49UJSAT5 1 (In open court; jury not present) 2 THE COURT: Good afternoon, all. Please be seated. 3 Mr. Fletcher reminds me that we'll do the 10:00 4 o'clock conference here tomorrow, here, this courtroom. 5 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, if you could please request or 6 direct the marshals -- we already submitted a request through 7 the usual channels for the marshals but, that request said they 8 should produce Mr. Sattar to Pearl Street. 9 If you would please request the marshals to please 10 accept the production order as requiring the production here, 11 even though that is not what it says because otherwise we can't 12 go and submit it in the submission time. 13 THE CLERK: I'll give them a call. 14 THE COURT: I ask the marshals to assure that. 15 THE MARSHAL: When we bring him back later in the day, 16 we'll convey that verbally directly to the personnel. 17 THE COURT: Thank you. Mr. Fletcher will call. 18 Mr. Fletcher assures me that he will call also, okay? 19 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, the government is next going 20 to call Agent Kerns, and I just wanted to advise the court of 21 one small point relating to his testimony. 22 We are going to be asking him to authenticate a DVD 23 which is marked as Government Exhibit 1320. That DVD contains 24 five audio files, but after the DVD was made, the government 25 realized that the first audio file on there is irrelevant. It SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6487 49UJSAT5 1 is a six-second recording which is nothing but someone dialing 2 some digits, not even enough digits to be a telephone number, 3 and then hanging up. 4 So when we offer the disc in evidence, we are going to 5 offer the disc, but only four, the other four audio files 6 contained on it, and I can recite the individual government 7 exhibit numbers of the audio files now if the court wishes. 8 I certainly will at the time I offer them, but we just 9 wanted to make the court and counsel aware of that. As I said, 10 it is our view that that 5th file is simply irrelevant. 11 MR. TIGAR: Your Honor, we have reviewed Government 12 Exhibit 1320. The file that the government doesn't wish to 13 offer is a 101 kilobyte file that does show only some digits 14 being dialed. 15 The conclusion that somebody hung up after that is not 16 borne out by the LUDS. In fact, what happens, and the reason 17 these calls got broken up probably is they were hook flashes, 18 to trigger call waiting, pickups or third party. 19 So I see no reason why we shouldn't offer all of them. 20 I intend to try to figure out from these witnesses how it is 21 that we got one call into six files, and that one is the first 22 one in the sequence. I don't see any objection to introducing 23 it. There is nothing substantive about it, but I would like to 24 question the witness about it. 25 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, the LUDS which Mr. Tigar cites SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6488 49UJSAT5 1 are precisely what indicate that that first audio file is 2 irrelevant, because the LUDS show only one call between 3 Mr. Sattar and Mr. Yousry on that date at that time, and that 4 is a completed call. That is the call contained or recorded in 5 the second audio file on this DVD. 6 When someone dials and the call is not completed, that 7 call would not show up on the LUDS records, and that was 8 testified to by the Verizon witness who was here. 9 And so the fact there is only the one completed call 10 in the LUDS is what indicates that that first audio file is not 11 relevant. There isn't any basis for Mr. Tigar's assertion that 12 there was flash-hooking at that point. I agree with him 13 that -- sorry -- let me pause to say, flash-hooking, I don't 14 know if that term was used before, but it is when the button 15 for hanging up the phone is quickly depressed and released. 16 I believe that the telephone company witness 17 testified -- although he may not have used that terminology -- 18 that is the way the user would use three-way calling, to 19 connect the different parties to each other. But when the call 20 is first placed from Mr. Sattar to Mr. Yousry, the LUDS 21 indicate that that is just a regular outgoing call, not a 22 three-way call. So there is simply no basis to believe that 23 there is any flash-hooking by Mr. Sattar in placing the 24 original call to Mr. Yousry. 25 So whatever Mr. Tigar's theory is why there are other SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6489 49UJSAT5 1 separate audio files, there is no reason to believe that it 2 applies to that first audio file, and the government believes 3 that that first audio file is irrelevant and that introducing 4 it and allowing Mr. Tigar to question about it will simply 5 increase the confusion of the jury over all of this. 6 MR. TIGAR: Your Honor, the LUDS show one call at 6:24 7 from Mr. Sattar's phone to Yousry. The Lockheed Martin system 8 records only one call at 6:24. That is the call the government 9 doesn't want to introduce. That is 101 KB. 10 Then there is a call and there is talking. That is at 11 6:25 pm, according to the Lockheed Martin system. One of the 12 things I have been trying to do here, your Honor, is figure out 13 why what apparently are continuous conversations that people 14 are having get broken up into pieces and chunks of what could 15 be talking go missing. That is one of the things I have been 16 trying to figure out. 17 I think that we have a working theory, and whether I 18 am right or wrong about it, I believe I am entitled to explore 19 with the agent the basis in the computer files on this diskette 20 that would support that theory. 21 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, as you may have noticed, when 22 the government presented the charts 1800 A through 1800 U last 23 week, the clocks in the FBI's recording system and the clocks 24 in the phone company's system that generates its records were 25 not exactly in synch with each other, and so it was common that SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6490 49UJSAT5 1 there were discrepancies of about 30 seconds between a time in 2 a phone record and a time according to the FBI's reporting 3 system. 4 One of the witnesses testified that when a phone 5 record says that a call was at 6:24, for example, that that 6 could mean 6:24 and 59 seconds. It doesn't necessarily mean 7 6:24:OO, and so the government's submission is that the only 8 good-faith construction of this evidence is that the audio 9 file, the second audio file on this DVD which has a start time 10 of 6:25: 13 pm, or 1825:13, as it is identified in the audio 11 file, in the name of the audio file, that that is the call, as 12 Mr. Tigar just said, that's the -- it is about a 9-minute 13 recording, it is a conversation between Mr. Sattar and 14 Mr. Yousry, that that is the call which the LUDS say was at 15 6:24. 16 And the dialing of approximately five digits in the 17 six second recording before that is irrelevant and will just be 18 used to confuse the jury. 19 THE COURT: I could not reasonably find at this point 20 that the possible relevance of the items that Agent Kerns 21 recorded on the DVD is so irrelevant that the danger of 22 confusion to the jury outweighs any relevance. 23 The jury is able, very able to understand when 24 confusion is being raised for the sake of confusion, and the 25 parties can well explain it to the jury. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6491 49UJSAT5 1 If, in fact, there are only four relevant audio files, 2 and those are the files that go along with the phone company 3 records and explain the so-called gap, and that the additional 4 audio file that was recorded on the DVD by Agent Kerns is a 5 second level of attempted confusion for the jury, that the 6 original gap is not a gap, that is explained by the four audio 7 files, and that the fifth audio file is, in fact, irrelevant, 8 and that's also an effort to confuse the jury. 9 The jury gets these things, but listening to the 10 parties, I couldn't conclude that the possible relevance is 11 outweighed by danger of unfair confusion. There is no issue 12 here about any other issues with respect to the call. It has 13 already been produced to the defendant. 14 The call is apparently an incomplete call of some 15 sort. All of the digits are not even there, and the government 16 says it is completely irrelevant. The jury can decide that. 17 Yes? 18 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, I don't know whether I should 19 ask for a five-minute break, because I was not planning on 20 offering that first audio file. 21 THE COURT: Sure, by all means. 22 MS. BAKER: The two documents that I had marked as 23 exhibits relating to the files on the DVD don't even reflect 24 the existence of that 5th audio, so I would like to just go and 25 print new versions of these documents so that the documents SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6492 49UJSAT5 1 reflect that 5th file as well. 2 THE COURT: Sure, and you can do that. We'll take a 3 break. How long do you want? 4 MS. BAKER: I need to just walk back to my office, 5 print the documents and come back. I think that will take me 6 about five minutes. 7 THE COURT: You can take longer than that. Let me 8 know when you're ready to start. 9 MS. BAKER: Sure. Thank you. I appreciate it. 10 (Recess) 11 THE COURT: All right. Please be seated, all. 12 The government may call its witness. 13 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, shall I bring him in and put 14 him on the witness stand? 15 THE COURT: Yes. 16 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, I placed new copies of the 17 exhibits for the court here on the edge of Mr. Fletcher's desk. 18 THE COURT: Mr. Fletcher, call in the jury. 19 (Jury present) 20 THE COURT: Please be seated, all. All right. The 21 government can call its next witness. 22 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, the government recalls Scott 23 Kerns. 24 SCOTT KERNS, 25 recalled as a witness by the Government, SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6493 49UJSAT5 1 having been previously duly sworn, testified as follows: 2 DIRECT EXAMINATION 3 THE CLERK: You're reminded you're still under oath. 4 THE WITNESS: I understand. 5 BY MS. BAKER: 6 Q. Agent Kerns, I have already placed on the witness stand 7 there in front of you two documents and one disc. The disc is 8 marked for identification as Government Exhibit 1320, and the 9 documents are marked for identification as Government Exhibits 10 1320 L and 1320 L2. 11 Do you recognize the disc Government Exhibit 1320? 12 A. Yes, I do. 13 Q. What is it? 14 A. This is the 6th DVD that I have created that has evidence 15 for trial on it. 16 Q. When did you make that DVD? 17 A. On 9-22-04. 18 Q. Did you mark it with your initials? 19 A. Yes, I did. 20 Q. From which telephone number were the calls recorded or the 21 audio files recorded there on that DVD? 22 A. They were recorded off of 718-442-3513. 23 Q. Did you make that DVD in the same manner as the other DVDs 24 about which you previously testified? 25 A. Yes, I did. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6494 49UJSAT5 Kerns - direct 1 Q. Are the audio files on that DVD from one date or more than 2 one date? 3 A. One date. 4 Q. What is that date? 5 A. 11-5-1999. 6 Q. If you would look, please, at the document marked for 7 identification as Government Exhibit 1320 L, is that a list of 8 the audio files that are on that DVD with your corresponding 9 government exhibit numbers? 10 A. Yes, it is. 11 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, I offer Government Exhibits 12 1320 and 1320 L. 13 MR. TIGAR: No objection. 14 THE COURT: All right. Government Exhibits 1320 and 15 1320 L received in evidence. 16 (Government's Exhibits 1320 and 1320 L received in 17 evidence) 18 BY MS. BAKER: 19 Q. Now, let me ask you to look, please, at Government Exhibit 20 1320 L2. Is that also a list of audio files? 21 A. Yes, it is. 22 Q. Does that reflect the five audio files on Government 23 Exhibit 1320? 24 A. Yes, it does. 25 Q. Does it also reflect one other audio file? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6495 49UJSAT5 Kerns - direct 1 A. Yes, it does. 2 Q. Let me ask you first about the audio files that are on 3 Government Exhibit 1320. What is the start time of the first 4 audio file? 5 A. It is 18:24:59. 6 Q. What does that convert to on a 12-hour clock? 7 A. It is 6:24:59 pm. 8 Q. Now, let me show you -- and put Government Exhibit 1320 L2 9 aside for a moment. 10 MS. BAKER: Before I ask you the other question, the 11 government offers Government Exhibit 1320 L2? 12 MR. TIGAR: No objection. 13 THE COURT: Government Exhibit 1320 L2 received in 14 evidence. 15 (Government's Exhibit 1320 L2 received in evidence) 16 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, I would like to show the 17 witness and the jury Government Exhibit 1300 L, which was 18 previously admitted. 19 THE COURT: All right. 20 (At this point, Government Exhibit 1300 L, was 21 displayed to the jury) 22 BY MS. BAKER: 23 Q. Showing you the first page of Government Exhibit 1300 L, do 24 you recognize that document? 25 A. Yes, I do. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6496 49UJSAT5 Kerns - direct 1 Q. What is that? 2 A. This was a list on one of the prior DVDs that I had made, 3 that I had brought to court earlier, one of my prior 4 testimonies. 5 Q. Let me ask you to look, please, at the 5th audio file in 6 this list and see if I can mark it on the screen. 7 A. I see it. 8 Q. I put a blue arrow next to it in the right-hand margin. It 9 is the audio file identified as Government Exhibit 1034. On 10 what telephone number was that audio file recorded? 11 A. 718-442-3513. 12 Q. On what date? 13 A. On November 5th of 1999. 14 Q. At what time did that audio file start? 15 A. 18:36:42. 16 Q. What is that in 12-hour time? 17 A. It would be 6:36:42 pm. 18 Q. Now, if you would turn back, please, to Government Exhibit 19 1320 L2, is the audio file that I was just asking you about, 20 Government Exhibit 1034, the 5th one that is shown in 21 Government Exhibit 1320 L2? 22 A. Yes, it is. 23 Q. I am sorry. The 6th one? 24 A. The 6th one. 25 MS. BAKER: May I display 1320 L2? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6497 49UJSAT5 Kerns - direct 1 THE COURT: Yes. 2 MS. BAKER: I am displaying a photocopy to the jury 3 because Agent Kerns is holding the original up there on the 4 witness stand. 5 BY MS. BAKER: 6 Q. Directing your attention to the left-hand column, are those 7 the start times of the five audio files that are on Government 8 Exhibit 1320, followed by the start time of the audio file 1034 9 which is on the other disc? 10 A. Yes, it is. 11 Q. Were those audio files all recorded, one after another, on 12 that Telephone No. 718-442-3513? 13 A. Yes. 14 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, if I might display to the jury 15 a previously admitted exhibit, Government Exhibit 1800 C. 16 THE COURT: All right. 17 BY MS. BAKER: 18 Q. Agent Kerns, let me direct your attention to the row near 19 the bottom of this page, which is Government Exhibit 1800 C, 20 and it is the row for Government Exhibit 1034, and that number 21 appears in the first column of that row. 22 Do you see that row? 23 A. Yes, I do. 24 Q. Directing your attention to the 5th column of that row 25 which starts with the word LUDS -- SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6498 49UJSAT5 Kerns - direct 1 A. Ah-huh. 2 Q. -- according to this exhibit, the LUDS show a call at 6:24 3 pm, made on Mr. Sattar's telephone. 4 Now, if you would look back, please, and compare it 5 with Government Exhibit 1320 L2 -- 6 A. Ah-huh. 7 Q. -- are all of these audio files -- well, withdrawn. 8 Before I ask you that, again, as you testified a few 9 minutes ago, what was the start time of the audio file 10 Government Exhibit 1034? 11 A. It's 18:24:59 seconds. 12 Q. Which is what again in 12-hour time? 13 A. Yes, it is. 14 Q. I am sorry, what is it in -- 15 A. Sorry. In 12-hour time, it is 6:24:59. 16 Q. No. I am sorry. I am asking you about 1034, which is the 17 bottom row. 18 A. It would be 6:36:42. 19 Q. Now, looking back at 1800 C, do you see that time reflected 20 in the third column of 1800 C? 21 A. Ah -- 22 Q. I am sorry. In the row for Government Exhibit 1034, in the 23 third column of that row? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. That is the start time of that audio file? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6499 49UJSAT5 Kerns - direct 1 A. Yes, it is. 2 Q. Moving back over to the 5th row where it notes 6:24 pm, are 3 you with me? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Looking at the exhibit that you're holding, 1320 L2, are 6 the five audio files on Government Exhibit 1320, the new disc, 7 all recorded within that time period, between 6:24 pm and 8 6:36:42 pm? 9 A. Yes, they are. 10 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, may I have a minute? 11 THE COURT: Yes. 12 (Pause) 13 MS. BAKER: Nothing further. 14 MR. TIGAR: May I inquire, your Honor? 15 THE COURT: Yes. 16 CROSS EXAMINATION 17 BY MR. TIGAR: 18 Q. Agent Kerns, you made the disc that is now in evidence as 19 Government Exhibit 1320 on September 22nd? 20 A. Yes, I did. 21 Q. Shortly after 5:00 pm? 22 A. Yes. It was late in the day. I don't know if it was 5:00. 23 I would actually have to boot up the disc and take a look at 24 it. 25 MR. TIGAR: May I show the witness 1320 L, your Honor? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6500 49UJSAT5 Kerns - cross 1 THE COURT: Yes. 2 BY MR. TIGAR: 3 Q. Showing you what is in evidence as Government Exhibit 1320 4 L, do you see the last modified time? 5 A. Yes, I do. 6 Q. Would that be the time when you made this disc? 7 A. Actually, that would be the time that I copied it from the 8 one system where it was on MO to the Windows computer. That is 9 not necessarily when I burned the disc. That is when it is 10 actually copied-across. 11 But I do remember I made this disc late in the day, 12 and I know it was on the 22nd because I have my initials on the 13 22nd. 14 Q. Have you spoken to Agent Sorrells about this disc and the 15 calls that are on it since September 22nd? 16 A. I'm sure I have, yes. 17 Q. Have you talked to him about what happened on Mr. Sattar's 18 telephone between 6:24 pm and 6:36 pm? 19 A. I don't remember if we had discussed that, what had 20 happened. They said that they needed more calls. There were 21 prior calls to the 18:36:42, and I was told what they were, so 22 I pulled the MO, because they're on MO, and made a DVD. 23 Q. You said you were told. Who told you? 24 A. I believe both Agent Sorrells and Ms. Baker had told me 25 different times on either that day or the day before. It was SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6501 49UJSAT5 Kerns - cross 1 on 9-22 when they said we need to make a DVD. 2 Q. Have you listened to the audio of any of these files? 3 A. Yes, I have. 4 Q. When did you do that? 5 A. I believe it was -- I don't believe it was on the 22nd -- I 6 believe it was sometime the beginning of this week when I had 7 created the extra copies that were needed for everyone 8 associated for this case, where I listened to the first one and 9 just the beginning of the second one on this particular list. 10 Q. Did you ever listen to them together with Ms. Sulliman? 11 A. Oh, no. 12 Q. You know who she is, right? 13 A. Yes. No. 14 Q. She is the translator? 15 A. Yes. No. When I actually listened to the beginning, I was 16 just sitting at one of my computers. 17 Q. The call, when you say the beginning, you listened to this 18 one that is Government Exhibit 1270, right? 19 A. Yes, I did. 20 Q. On that you hear some noises that sound like somebody 21 pushing a touch tone phone, correct? 22 A. That's correct. 23 Q. And then it terminates, correct? 24 A. That's correct. 25 Q. So this call is referred on the Lockheed Martin system, SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6502 49UJSAT5 Kerns - cross 1 right? 2 A. Yes, it was. 3 Q. The Lockheed Martin system is an active detect triggered 4 system, correct? 5 A. It is my understanding that is one of the ways it could 6 have been set up, that's correct. 7 Q. And, in fact, is it your understanding, sir, that SRI, or 8 Signal Related Information, for these calls use that term, 9 activity detection? 10 A. It could. It could have been one of the fields. I don't 11 know because I have never actually used that system. 12 MR. TIGAR: May I show the witness, your Honor, LS 48? 13 THE COURT: Yes. 14 BY MR. TIGAR: 15 Q. Showing you, sir, what is in evidence as LS 48, do you see 16 the telephone number there, Mr. Sattar's telephone number? 17 A. Yes, I do. 18 Q. Do you see the session start? 19 A. That's correct. 20 Q. And that's the call that begins at 6:36 pm and 42 seconds, 21 correct? 22 A. Correct. 23 Q. You see the words "activity detect," right? 24 A. Under "Event," that's correct. 25 Q. Is it your understanding, sir, that the Lockheed Martin SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6503 49UJSAT5 Kerns - cross 1 system was programmed to turn itself on and off when somebody 2 depressed the switcher on the telephone? 3 MS. BAKER: Objection. Lack of personal knowledge. 4 THE COURT: Do you know? 5 THE WITNESS: I just know, your Honor, that activity 6 detect was one of the settings, but how that initiated the 7 start of the equipment, I don't know that specifically how long 8 a time-frame or anything along those natures or decibel level 9 or anything along those lines. 10 Q. Do you know of your personal knowledge what activity detect 11 means in an SRI? 12 A. My understanding of activity detect is that there is some 13 type of noise that initiates the recording equipment to turn 14 itself on or turn itself off. 15 MR. TIGAR: May I show the witness 1800 C, your Honor? 16 THE COURT: Yes. 17 BY MR. TIGAR: 18 Q. This is the exhibit you were looking at just a moment ago 19 sir. You see a call at 6:24 pm to Yousry, correct? 20 A. That's correct. 21 Q. Based on your listening to 1270, which we looked at just a 22 moment ago, do you have an opinion, based on your personal 23 knowledge, of whether the call at 6:24 pm to Mr. Yousry's phone 24 is call 1270? 25 A. I don't have an opinion because all I heard were the tones. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6504 49UJSAT5 Kerns - cross 1 I don't know what they were dialing or why it 2 disconnected. 3 (Continued on next page) 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6505 49UMSAT6 Kerns - cross 1 Q. Did you listen to the beginning of 1271? 2 A. I did. 3 MR. TIGAR: May I show the witness 1320L, your Honor? 4 THE COURT: Yes. 5 Q. 1271 begins -- what does it begin with, as you heard it? 6 A. You hear someone pick up a telephone. You hear dialing. I 7 heard ringing. Someone answered the phone, asked for someone, 8 and then I stopped listening to it. 9 Q. Now, that call shows that it began, according to the 10 Lockheed Martin system, at 6:25 and 13 seconds, correct? 11 A. That's correct. 12 Q. And you were not able to tell, based on what you heard, who 13 was talking or what they were saying, correct? 14 A. No. 15 Q. They were speaking a language you don't speak? 16 A. Once they asked for someone, that was an actual connection 17 and I just -- I stopped listening to it at that point. 18 MR. TIGAR: May I show the witness, please, 1320L2? 19 THE COURT: Yes. 20 MR. TIGAR: In evidence. 21 Q. Now, sir, 1320L2 has a list of start times, correct? 22 A. Correct. 23 Q. Now, the first start time is 18:24:59, right? 24 A. Correct. 25 Q. And 18:24 or 6:24 p.m. is the -- is a time on 1800C that SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6506 49UMSAT6 Kerns - cross 1 you just looked at, correct? 2 A. Correct. 3 Q. Now, how long -- what's the ending time on 1270? 4 A. I don't know. 5 Q. If I ask you that question with respect to these other 6 calls, do you know the ending time on these calls? 7 A. No, I don't. 8 Q. Now, the ending time is something that would be in the SRI, 9 correct? 10 A. It is my understanding that at the end of the SRI data 11 there is usually a field where it puts the session end time, 12 that's correct. 13 Q. And if we were to take the end time for each of these calls 14 we could figure out if there were any gaps in the recording, 15 correct? 16 A. You could find -- I wouldn't say you could find out if 17 there were any gaps in the recording. You could find out if 18 there were any gaps between the time that telephone went 19 unactive and then went active again. It doesn't mean that 20 there was gaps in the recording. 21 Q. Accepted. 22 Do you have an opinion, sir, based on your personal 23 knowledge of whether this sequence of events? 24 MR. TIGAR: May I show the witness 1800C, your Honor? 25 THE COURT: Yes. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6507 49UMSAT6 Kerns - cross 1 Q. Whether the sequence of events here in column 5, the 2 outgoing calls, represents one continuous telephone call 3 between Mr. Sattar and Mr. Yousry to which other people are 4 then added and people are dropped, or not? 5 A. I don't know because I only listened to the first and only 6 the beginning of the second, so I don't know what happened in 7 the calls after that. 8 Q. So to know whether or not that was one continuous call we 9 would have to ask someone who listened to the whole call, 10 right? 11 A. As well as someone who if they are speaking in a foreign 12 language to understand what they are saying at the end of the 13 call, whether it is actually ended or whether there is a break 14 in the line or there is some other type of problem, yes. 15 Q. And that was not the test that you were asked to do, 16 correct? 17 A. No. 18 Q. Now, the copy that you made for court that is reflected on 19 1320L, was that the first time -- withdrawn. 20 That was not the first time, was it, that you had 21 copied these calls in VOC format for someone to use, correct? 22 A. No. They should have been turned over with all of the 23 discovery information some time during the discovery phase of 24 the case. 25 Q. And in addition to the discovery phase do you recall making SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6508 49UMSAT6 Kerns - cross 1 a copy for Ms. Soliman, the other translators to use? 2 A. I don't believe that I made a copy for them to use, I 3 believe. I made several of these DVDs. I don't know -- I did 4 not give one to her personally. We could have added these 5 calls back to the system and they could have listened to it 6 there as well. 7 Q. Do you recall making a copy of these telephone calls that 8 we have been discussing on the 28th of October 2003? 9 MS. BAKER: Objection. 10 THE COURT: Basis? 11 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, I would ask to be heard 12 outside the presence of the jury. 13 THE COURT: Could we move on? 14 MR. TIGAR: Yes, your Honor. 15 May I approach, your Honor? 16 THE COURT: Sure. 17 Q. Sir, I am going to bring you a laptop computer, and you 18 have 1320 right here with you, do you not? 19 A. Yes, sir. 20 Q. Would you please place 1320 in and load the directory. 21 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, may I approach so that I can 22 see? 23 THE COURT: Yes. 24 A. I see it. 25 Q. Do you have it? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6509 49UMSAT6 Kerns - cross 1 A. Um-hum. 2 Q. Would you please load and tell us what time the end time on 3 Exhibit 1271 is, the call in evidence as 1271. You're doing 4 that by looking at the SRI -- 5 A. In Note Pad. It is a big file. It is taking a couple of 6 seconds. 7 Q. It is loading. Have you opened the file? 8 A. It is open. 9 Q. You're opening it in Note Pad, correct? 10 A. Correct. 11 Q. Using Note Pad then, which you and I have talked about 12 before, please tell us the end time on 1271. Can you tell us 13 what that is, please? 14 A. Yes. It says session end is November 5 of 1999 at 15 18:34:56. 16 Q. 18:34:56, correct? 17 A. Correct. 18 Q. That's 6 p.m., 34 minutes and 56 seconds, right? 19 A. Correct. 20 Q. That's the same day, November 5, right? 21 A. Yes, it is. 22 Q. Looking at the exhibits in front of you, would you tell us 23 the start time on 1272, which is the next call? 24 A. 1272 starts at 18:35:47. 25 Q. And is that 51 seconds after the end of 1271? SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6510 49UMSAT6 Kerns - cross 1 A. Yes, it is. 2 Q. Based on your personal knowledge, sir, do you know how or 3 why -- just based on your personal knowledge -- there is 51 4 seconds between the end of 1271 and the beginning of 1272? 5 A. I don't know. 6 MR. TIGAR: May I approach, your Honor? 7 THE COURT: Yes. 8 Q. I am going to retrieve the laptop from you, if I may, sir. 9 If you eject the diskette from the drive or do whatever it is 10 you need to do. Thank you. 11 A. You're welcome. 12 MR. TIGAR: May I show the witness, your Honor, 1320L? 13 THE COURT: Yes. 14 Q. Now, looking, sir, at 1320L, again, what is the reason that 15 it says last modified September 22, 2004? 16 A. As I previously testified, that is the date when it gets 17 copied from the machine where the MO -- where the call actually 18 exists when I copy it to the computer where I actually burn the 19 DVDs. 20 Q. To review that, if someone asked you for these calls, you 21 went and found them on an MO disk, correct? 22 A. Correct. 23 Q. And then you placed the MO disk in a computer and you saw a 24 directory, correct? 25 A. Correct. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6511 49UMSAT6 Kerns - cross 1 Q. And that's the same thing that we would all of us do if we 2 were to put some medium such as a diskette in our home 3 computer, correct? 4 A. Correct. 5 Q. I mean, is that a windows system on the MO? 6 A. No. It is a UNIX system. 7 Q. That's the UNIX. Then you burned or made a copy onto a DVD 8 from that computer, correct? 9 A. From the Windows computer, correct. 10 Q. I need to understand -- 11 A. The UNIX machine is where the MO drive is. That's where I 12 actually search and look for the calls because that's the 13 system. That's the machine, that's how we look for things. 14 Q. You got that? 15 A. Correct. 16 Q. Then you take the MO disk out of that? 17 A. No. Then I make a connection from that computer to my 18 Windows machine. I go to the Windows machine, I look back at 19 the UNIX computer. I find the call, I copy it to a folder on 20 that computer in this case. I name it DVD No. 6. I copy all 21 the calls that I need and then I burn a DVD. 22 Q. So the process is a three-step process: First, the MO, 23 then to the hard drive of a Windows computer, correct? 24 A. Correct. 25 Q. And the hard drive of that Windows computer or that Windows SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6512 49UMSAT6 Kerns - cross 1 computer looks like a computer that we would see in ads for 2 Windows computers. It has a monitor, a keyboard and a central 3 processing unit, right? 4 A. Correct. 5 Q. And it is from that that you make the copy, correct? 6 A. That's correct. 7 Q. Now, at any time during your work with these files did you 8 talk to anyone on the CART team? 9 A. CART, no. 10 Q. Do you have in your shop a utility called Bookmark? 11 MS. BAKER: Objection. Relevance. 12 THE COURT: Overruled. 13 A. I don't have a utility called Bookmark, but are you 14 referring in Internet Explorer you can book mark web pages. 15 But that's the only book mark. 16 Q. No. I'm not talking about that. 17 A. I don't have a utility called Bookmark. 18 Q. To be clear, you don't have a forensic data tool kit that 19 has something called Bookmark in it, right? 20 A. No. 21 Q. And have you ever discussed that with Mr. Grasso or anyone 22 else in CART? 23 A. No. 24 Q. Until you came here today, did anyone ask you to check the 25 start and end times or the end times of the various calls that SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6513 49UMSAT6 Kerns - cross 1 are listed on 1320L and 1320L2? 2 A. Ms. Baker and I discussed it on, I believe, one call prior 3 to coming here. 4 MR. TIGAR: May I have a moment, your Honor? 5 THE COURT: Yes. 6 Q. Did you make any notes or memoranda in connection with the 7 matters you have testified about today, sir? 8 A. No. 9 MR. TIGAR: Other than the open matter, your Honor, I 10 have no further questions. 11 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, I have no questions. But if I 12 might just confer with Mr. Tigar for one minute, maybe we can 13 resolve that other issue. 14 THE COURT: Sure. 15 MR. TIGAR: Your Honor, thank you for the opportunity 16 to confer. 17 I understand that Ms. Soliman is going to be a witness 18 and I will have the opportunity to put the question and she 19 knows the answer and so on. 20 With that understanding, I have no further questions 21 of Agent Kerns. 22 THE COURT: Ms. Baker. 23 MS. BAKER: I have no questions. 24 THE COURT: Agent Kerns, you're excused. You may step 25 down. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6514 49UMSAT6 Kerns - cross 1 (Witness excused) 2 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, the government calls Amira 3 Soliman. 4 MS. BAKER: Your Honor, if I might retrieve the 5 exhibits from the witness stand. Mr. Morvillo will. 6 THE DEPUTY CLERK: The witness, having been previously 7 sworn, she is reminded she is still under oath. 8 AMIRA SOLIMAN, recalled. 9 THE COURT: Mr. Barkow, you may examine. 10 DIRECT EXAMINATION 11 BY MR. BARKOW: 12 Q. Good afternoon, Ms. Soliman. 13 A. Yes. 14 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, we would ask permission to 15 have Ms. Soliman testify in the area of Arabic to English 16 translation. 17 MR. TIGAR: No objection. 18 THE COURT: The witness may testify. 19 Q. Ms. Soliman, first I am going to ask Ms. Griffith to play 20 what is in evidence as Government Exhibit 1270 for you. I am 21 going to ask you, if you can, to count the number of beeps that 22 you hear. If you could pay attention to that when we play it, 23 and after that I am going to ask you a question about that. 24 A. The number of beeps? 25 Q. The number of beeps. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6515 49UMSAT6 Soliman - direct 1 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, if the jurors can put their 2 headphones on. I think there might be a headset for 3 Ms. Soliman as well. 4 May I approach and show Ms. Soliman how to use the 5 headset, your Honor? 6 THE COURT: Yes. 7 Ladies and gentlemen, if you put your headsets on, 8 turn them on. 9 (Audio DVD played) 10 Q. Ms. Soliman, if you could take your headset off. 11 THE COURT: Turn them off, ladies and gentlemen. 12 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, they could actually leave 13 them on. I am going to ask them to put them on, but take them 14 off their heads. 15 THE COURT: Leave them on, ladies and gentlemen. 16 Q. Ms. Soliman, were you able to count the beep tones that you 17 heard there? 18 A. Six or seven. 19 Q. Now, Ms. Soliman, I'd like to play for you -- 20 MR. BARKOW: If I could ask Ms. Griffith, what is in 21 evidence, just the beginning, the first 10, 15 seconds or so of 22 what is in evidence as Government Exhibit 1271. If I can ask 23 everyone to put their headphones on again? 24 THE COURT: Yes. 25 (Audio DVD played) SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6516 49UMSAT6 Soliman - direct 1 Q. Ms. Soliman -- 2 MR. BARKOW: If the jurors could take their headsets 3 off, but again leave them on; that is, the power. 4 Q. Ms. Soliman, did you hear the beginning of that recording? 5 A. Yes, I did. 6 Q. Do you know who the participants were in that conversation? 7 A. Yes, I do. 8 Q. Who are they? 9 A. Ahmed Abdel Sattar and Mohammed Yousry. 10 MR. BARKOW: At this point I would ask to play 11 Government Exhibit 1271, which is in evidence, and play 12 approximately the last 10 to 15 seconds of it, if everyone 13 could put their headsets back on again. 14 THE COURT: All right. 15 (Audio DVD played) 16 MR. BARKOW: If everyone could take their headsets 17 off. 18 Q. Ms. Soliman, did you hear the end of that conversation? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. What was the very last thing that was said? 21 A. Sattar telling Yousry: Hold a second, hold a second. 22 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, at this point we would 23 request permission to play in succession Government Exhibit 24 1272, which is in evidence; Government Exhibit 1273, which is 25 in evidence; Government Exhibit 1274, which is in evidence, and SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6517 49UMSAT6 Soliman - direct 1 the first 10 to 15 seconds of Government Exhibit 1034, which is 2 in evidence. 3 THE COURT: All right. 4 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, if everyone could put their 5 headsets back on. 6 THE COURT: Yes. 7 MR. BARKOW: This will be Government Exhibit 1272 8 first. 9 (At this point, Government Exhibit 1272 in evidence, 10 played to the jury) 11 MR. BARKOW: If we could play Government Exhibit 1273. 12 (At this point, Government Exhibit 1273 in evidence, 13 played to the jury) 14 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, at this point if we could 15 play Government Exhibit 1274. 16 THE COURT: All right. 17 (At this point, Government Exhibit 1274 in evidence, 18 played to the jury) 19 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, if we could play just the 20 first ten seconds or so with an accompanying transcript -- if 21 we could play the first 10 seconds or so of Government Exhibit 22 1034, which is in evidence with accompanying transcript 23 Government Exhibit 1034X. 24 THE COURT: All right. 25 MR. BARKOW: This will just take a second to load, SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6518 49UMSAT6 Soliman - direct 1 your Honor, because it is on a different DVD. 2 (At this point, Government Exhibit 1034 in evidence, 3 displayed and played to the jury) 4 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, may I approach. If the 5 jurors and everyone can take their headsets off. There is only 6 a minute or two half, but I think I can actually finish in that 7 time. 8 THE COURT: All right. 9 MR. BARKOW: May I approach? 10 THE COURT: Yes. 11 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, at this point I would like to 12 offer into evidence Government Exhibit 414. 13 MR. PAUL: We have never seen this. 14 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, I offer what I have shown to 15 counsel for identification as Government Exhibit 414. 16 MR. RUHNKE: Without objection. 17 MR. TIGAR: No. 18 THE COURT: Government Exhibit 414 received in 19 evidence. 20 (Government's Exhibit 414 received in evidence) 21 Q. Ms. Soliman, you were born and lived in Egypt? 22 A. Yes. 23 MR. BARKOW: May I publish this to the jury? 24 THE COURT: Yes. 25 Q. Ms. Soliman, I'm showing you if you could look at it -- SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6519 49UMSAT6 Soliman - direct 1 what is this, Government Exhibit 414 in evidence? 2 A. It is a map of Egypt. 3 Q. Could you hold this up for one second? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. I just want to ask you to point, if you could, with your 6 finger to a few cities. You can turn your chair if you need 7 to. 8 A. Okay. 9 Q. First, could you just point your finger and point to Cairo. 10 A. Here. 11 Q. And now could you point your finger to Al-Fayoum. 12 A. Here. 13 Q. And now could you point and put your finger near Al-Minya. 14 And now if you could, could you point and put your 15 finger where Manfaloot is? 16 A. Manfaloot? 17 Q. Yes. If you could point to Manfaloot. 18 THE COURT: Hold on. 19 A. Here. 20 THE COURT: If any of defense counsel wants to move 21 over to see this, they are welcome to. 22 MR. TIGAR: No. 23 Q. Just a few more, Ms. Soliman. Could you point your finger 24 to Asyut, if I'm pronouncing it correct? 25 A. Correct. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6520 49UMSAT6 Soliman - direct 1 Q. Next is Suhag. 2 A. Here. 3 Q. And next to Qena. 4 A. Here. 5 Q. And next to Luxor. 6 THE COURT: You have to keep your voice up. 7 A. Luxor. 8 Q. And, finally -- 9 THE COURT: And you said? 10 THE WITNESS: Luxor. I'm pointing to Luxor. 11 Q. You're saying Luxor? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. And finally could you point to Aswan. 14 MR. BARKOW: May I have just a minute, your Honor? 15 THE COURT: Yes. 16 MR. BARKOW: I have nothing further, your Honor. 17 THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, it is 4:30 and we 18 will break for the day and resume with the witness next week. 19 We are breaking for the weekend. We are resuming next 20 Monday, 9:30. 21 Please remember my continuing instructions over the 22 weekend now. Please don't talk about this case at all among 23 yourselves or with anyone else when you go home over the 24 weekend. Remember not to look at or listen to or read anything 25 to do with the case. If you should see or hear something SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6521 49UMSAT6 1 inadvertently that deals with the case, simply turn away. 2 Always remember to keep an open mind until you have 3 heard all of the evidence, I have instructed you on the law, 4 and you have gone to the jury room to begin your deliberations. 5 Fairness and justice to the parties requires that you do that. 6 With that, have a very good weekend and I look forward 7 to seeing you on Monday morning at 9:30. 8 All rise, please. Please follow Mr. Fletcher to the 9 jury room. 10 (Jury not present) 11 THE COURT: Please be seated, all. 12 The witness may step down. 13 MR. TIGAR: Your Honor, may the witness be admonished? 14 Because I now have her on cross. 15 THE COURT: Don't talk to anyone about your testimony. 16 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, can I tell the witness that 17 she needs actually to be back? 18 THE COURT: Don't talk to anyone about the substance 19 of your testimony. The government can tell you when to be 20 back, where to go. 21 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, Ms. Soliman is doing some 22 translating work with the government with respect to the Yousry 23 search materials. It may be necessary to talk to her about 24 those documents over the course of the weekend. I want to make 25 sure that's okay -- SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6522 49UMSAT6 1 MR. TIGAR: I certainly have no objection to that, 2 your Honor. We have been provided with Jencks material and my 3 cross-examination will be within the scope of what the 4 government has provided us, so that everybody understands. 5 THE COURT: Do you understand? 6 THE WITNESS: Yes, I do. 7 THE COURT: Don't talk to anyone about what you have 8 testified to, okay? 9 THE WITNESS: Yes, your Honor. 10 THE COURT: I was going to say, if the witness -- do 11 you expect to continue with the witness first thing on Monday 12 morning? Because there was a problem with schedules. Just as 13 long as the witness is back. 14 MR. BARKOW: Your Honor, the reason I raise that, I 15 didn't anticipate this was going to take to the end of the day. 16 I didn't know if Ms. Soliman knew she had to be back on Monday. 17 I don't have any further questions for her on Monday morning. 18 I wanted to make sure that Ms. Soliman knew that she had to be 19 here first thing Monday morning. 20 THE COURT: Ms. Soliman, can you be back here at 9:30 21 on Monday? 22 THE WITNESS: Yes. 23 THE COURT: You can talk to the government about where 24 to go so you're sure you're back here at 9:30 on Monday. I'll 25 see everyone at 10:00 here tomorrow. SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6523 49UMSAT6 1 MR. PAUL: Your Honor, I will not be able to be here 2 in the morning session. Mr. Fallick will be here. I have the 3 consent of my client to proceed without him. 4 MR. RUHNKE: I will not be here, but Mr. Stern will. 5 THE COURT: Anything else? 6 See you all tomorrow. 7 I don't mean to keep you. But where are you with 8 respect to the issues of Yousry search material? 9 MR. MORVILLO: Your Honor, as I believe Mr. Stern 10 mentioned this morning, we have spent a fair amount of time 11 negotiating over objections and at this point we have resolved 12 everything. So we have entered into some stipulations and I 13 believe that we are just going to move forward with the 14 presentation of the evidence. So there is nothing for the 15 Court to rule on. 16 THE COURT: All right. See you tomorrow. 17 (Adjourned to Friday, October 1, 2004 at 10:00 a.m.) 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300 6524 1 INDEX OF EXAMINATION 2 Examination of: Page 3 CHRISTINE MONACO 4 Direct By Mr. Morvillo . . . . . . . . . . . 6381 5 Cross By Mr. Stern . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6414 6 Redirect By Mr. Morvillo . . . . . . . . . . 6444 7 Recross By Mr. Stern . . . . . . . . . . . . 6447 8 WALID FARHOUD 9 Direct Mr. Barkow . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6450 10 SCOTT KERNS 11 Direct The Clerk . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6493 12 Cross By Mr. Tigar . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6499 13 AMIRA SOLIMAN 14 Direct By Mr. Barkow . . . . . . . . . . . . 6514 15 GOVERNMENT EXHIBITS 16 Exhibit No. Received 17 3536 D . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6388 18 2301A-2301R . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6393 19 2300S . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6410 20 2202 T, 2700 and 2700 T . . . . . . . . . 6461 21 2700TH . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6474 22 1320 and 1320 L . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6494 23 1320 L2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6495 24 414 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6518 25 SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. (212) 805-0300